Margery Simkin and Orly Sitowitz Interview - "Strange New Cast"

[00:00:00] This is Marjorie Simkin and Orly Sidowitz.

[00:00:03] And you're listening to Open Pike Night, the second most important cast of Strange New Worlds.

[00:00:19] Is this thing on? Hello? Hello? Welcome to Open Pike Night, the Strange New Worlds podcast

[00:00:40] where your personal logs are the prime directive. I'm your host, John T. Bolz,

[00:00:45] here tonight with my co-hosts. First up, the man who's been begging us to watch Blue Eyes Samurai

[00:00:51] between sessions of Strange New Worlds and casting shade at those who don't, Jesse Bailey.

[00:00:56] Look, it's a really good looking show and it sounds even better.

[00:01:01] And the man who's been filmmaking since junior high, he can self tape in his sleep.

[00:01:06] Host of Green Shirt, a newbie trek through next generation, Cameron.

[00:01:11] We at Open Pike Night are excited to be talking to these two amazing casting directors

[00:01:16] and not just because of all the extra clicks we'll get from confused fishing enthusiasts.

[00:01:21] Our guests tonight cast a wide net to forecast who will fit best

[00:01:25] and cast a long shadow with their impressive resumes. We're talking to the casting directors

[00:01:30] of Star Trek Discovery and Star Trek Strange New Worlds, Orly Sidowitz. Hey, hi there.

[00:01:37] And Marjorie Simkin. Hello.

[00:01:40] Thank you both for joining us tonight. We are thrilled to be talking to you. So like,

[00:01:46] you have had so much influence on modern Star Trek that it is, it's great to have folks who make

[00:01:53] so many great amazing decisions for the cast and crew we love.

[00:01:58] Well, we're excited to be here. That intro music's jam.

[00:02:03] It sure is. I don't think it's too small a thing to say that Anson Mount's charisma

[00:02:08] as Captain Pike is why there is a Strange New Worlds, which is why there is an Open Pike

[00:02:12] night. So we have to humbly thank you. Absolutely, absolutely. So I'll throw this

[00:02:18] out to either one who wants to answer it. Elevator pitch for most of us listeners and hosts.

[00:02:24] What does a casting director do? Marge, take it away.

[00:02:29] We're HR. We're HR. We're HR for a show. That's like, you know, the regular people pitch.

[00:02:36] And, you know, and I think just like HR departments do a lot more than people think they

[00:02:42] do. You know, I think that's the same for us. So you protect the show from the actors is what

[00:02:51] you're saying? I love it. Well, we're going to jump right in because we have some fantastic

[00:03:01] calls tonight from our listener. First up here is Melanie.

[00:03:05] Hi, Open Pike night. Hi, Marjorie and Ollie. This is Melanie from Germany. First of all,

[00:03:12] you have done an excellent job casting all the wonderful and beautiful actors for the cast of

[00:03:17] Discovery and of course of Strange New Worlds. Every single one is doing an incredible job and

[00:03:22] I enjoy watching them over and over again immensely. So onto my questions. I don't know

[00:03:29] anything about casting for a TV show, but how do you start? Do you have a clear image of the role?

[00:03:36] Are you looking for an actor who fits and could fill the role? Does an actor need to bring

[00:03:41] special knowledge such as martial arts or horse riding because this will be featured in an

[00:03:46] episode? How much do you know about what the characters would experience and do you cast

[00:03:51] accordingly? Well, those are my thoughts on that matter. And thanks again for getting us

[00:03:56] an extraordinary crew on the Enterprise. Take care and live long and prosper.

[00:04:02] So sweet. In Germany, that's so cool. Yeah. It just kind of blows your mind, you know,

[00:04:09] because we don't I think fully appreciate the range, you know, of stuff that you guys know.

[00:04:18] Those questions will take an hour and a half. I mean, that's the whole show.

[00:04:22] Oh, the dumb answer is, you know, we read a script. If we're lucky enough to get a script

[00:04:30] on a TV show, when we start for the pilot, there is a pilot script later, maybe not so much.

[00:04:37] But we get a script and we meet with the various and sundry decision makers and everybody

[00:04:45] throws into the hopper what they what they're looking for. But what makes this

[00:04:50] really different for us, I think is that, you know, we were dealing with characters that had,

[00:04:56] you know, that came from TOS. There was a cannon, you know, that was something that we hadn't

[00:05:03] really experienced before. You know, we're used to setting it up and that becomes the

[00:05:08] cannon for other people later. You know, I think in many ways, Pike is the classic example,

[00:05:15] or you're going to jump in on this a little bit. But I want I want to pat you on the head

[00:05:20] when we started this process, virtually patting on it. When we started Discovery and we were

[00:05:30] looking for the role that Jason eventually played, you know, Orly was a big fan of

[00:05:37] Anson's. And this also speaks to stuff later, which is, you know, what happened during the

[00:05:42] pandemic and and, you know, all of us starting to do everything virtually. Anson was in New

[00:05:48] York and Orly in her incredibly charming way convinced his somewhat reluctant representatives

[00:05:55] to ask him if he would read for that other role, for the other role. Oh, wow. And he

[00:06:02] agreed and he was in New York and he did it by him. He was like, you know, I'll put myself

[00:06:08] on tape. And he put and this was really before people were doing it. And it was such a gesture

[00:06:14] of goodwill and teamwork and willingness to do it, you know, all those things that you kind of

[00:06:22] look for in an actor that's going to do something. You know, it was so fantastic.

[00:06:26] And and then he really wasn't right for the part that we were doing then. But when Captain

[00:06:32] Pike came up and we started looking at Jeffrey Hunter, who had done it originally,

[00:06:38] Orly went, Oh, my God, it's Anson because the hair and, you know, whatever. And everybody was

[00:06:43] like, yeah, maybe. I don't know. And could we get him to read again? Which is like soul crushing

[00:06:50] for us because we're like, oh, shit, he's going to do this. He did it once. Is he going to do

[00:06:54] it again? And once again, he was game and he put himself on tape. This time, you know,

[00:07:02] we're in the Panda. He was up in the country. It was a little better setting than the kitchen,

[00:07:08] the part, the proper one. And, you know, nailed it, of course, and all the rest of it. But

[00:07:14] it was that willingness that was so I mean, aside from the performance that was,

[00:07:22] you know, so impressive to us. And it really is all to my partner Orly's persuasiveness.

[00:07:28] OK, I got it. Always both of us. But no, that wasn't like Margie said. It was the pandemic

[00:07:35] and it was before the pandemic. It was before, right, Marge? So we started with Lorca.

[00:07:42] And it's just one of those things sometimes where you have fans. I was a hell on wheels

[00:07:46] fan girl. What can I tell you? And I'd always liked it. I mean, it was one of those guilty

[00:07:51] pleasure shows. Right. And I just thought that guy's really cool. And like Margie told

[00:07:57] you, it just was it was an odd situation whereas Lorca came first and then Pike.

[00:08:02] And you're like, wait, he's perfect for Pike. I mean, when does that really happen? Because

[00:08:06] when we're casting this will come later, I'm sure we'll talk about it. But when you're casting

[00:08:10] the legacy characters and the canon characters, you have a blueprint of what you're looking for.

[00:08:14] Right. With the new characters, you have a lot more flexibility. But so how odd for him to

[00:08:19] really feel and look like Pike. That was just very bizarre when that happened.

[00:08:26] Orly line, she always says they fit the suit. Like sometimes you're sort of you're going

[00:08:31] through and you're going, yeah, they're really actors we love, but they don't fit the suit.

[00:08:35] It was like, it's the suit. Yes. Like this. You know, he was just I remember

[00:08:41] just getting in. We ran in when we had an office at that point. We ran in with a

[00:08:45] picture and we're like, look, this is undeniable. We had him side by side.

[00:08:50] And Margie and I were like, you see that right? And we'll see if he'll tape again.

[00:08:53] And he did. And to Margie's point, we always tell other actors on the show

[00:08:58] that he did that because for somebody like him to do that once is a maybe.

[00:09:04] And then he does it twice. And that's just when you're all in.

[00:09:07] And that speaks to either the project that he connected to so well or whatever it happened

[00:09:12] to be. But that speaks to the younger kids that sometimes now and acting and auditioning,

[00:09:18] tangent that don't want to tape and all of that stuff. And you're like, look what happened.

[00:09:22] So I got to say, I can't imagine how somebody would not want to tape.

[00:09:27] Like it's so easy. Like we do. We do kind of a similar thing with a podcast.

[00:09:32] And part of what we love about it is that you just get to sit at your house in your own space

[00:09:36] and do the things you love.

[00:09:38] Don't get us started.

[00:09:41] Don't get us started because we have this conversation daily.

[00:09:46] This will take the whole show too.

[00:09:48] Exactly.

[00:09:49] So is that, do you happen to know if like Anson being in his kitchen or maybe up in the country

[00:09:56] had anything to do with what they did with that character? Because we know Pike loves

[00:10:00] to cook and we know he's got a cabin. Like was that part of that or is it just magic?

[00:10:05] I don't know. I think that was, I don't think so.

[00:10:09] And I also don't remember asking him if he could ride a horse.

[00:10:14] Like I don't know if that came because he does or, you know, that's a question for the other guys.

[00:10:21] We'll get them back.

[00:10:23] Excellent.

[00:10:24] So that answers Melanie's question of you don't really take into account an actor's skill set

[00:10:28] like horse riding or martial arts?

[00:10:30] I will say on the martial arts, because she happened to mention it,

[00:10:32] we did a show called Badlands, Into the Badlands.

[00:10:36] And that was super important for a lot of those roles.

[00:10:40] If you couldn't do any martial arts, you weren't really auditioning for a lot of those roles.

[00:10:44] We had our office, we were entertained every day with people parkour off the walls.

[00:10:48] And it was like, let's have more auditions, you know? But it was,

[00:10:52] for that show, it was definitely important. So funny that she mentioned the martial arts of it all.

[00:10:57] I mean, it wasn't, you know, it isn't, you know, we always say the acting is first.

[00:11:03] And then if they have to do something special, you know, even the actors that did martial arts,

[00:11:09] they might not have been to the level of what you need.

[00:11:11] Obviously, that's where the stunt people come in.

[00:11:14] Just having the skill set is not enough because you're not seeing them do those skills.

[00:11:19] That's not the key thing. The key thing is you want to engage with a character

[00:11:23] and to engage with a character. They have to be a good actor and they have to be

[00:11:27] the right energy for that part. And that isn't a particular energy.

[00:11:32] I mean, sometimes you figure out who the character is once the actor has been cast.

[00:11:39] You know, you want someone funny, but, you know, if it had been someone else other than

[00:11:45] Carol Kane, then that character would have a different flavor profile sort of, you know?

[00:11:51] You probably see a lot of padding on actors' skills lists on resumes.

[00:11:58] Much like an HR rep would see on a resume.

[00:12:01] Gary Marshall loved reading the skills. You know, like he always read the skills.

[00:12:06] It just entertained him and then he would ask actors in auditions to do things that were on.

[00:12:12] And yes, you do sometimes get like a pause.

[00:12:18] This year you sing. You know, sing.

[00:12:21] That's great.

[00:12:21] What you mentioned in Gary Marshall leads to my next question, which is I imagine most people,

[00:12:26] just kind of assume the director does all the casting on a movie or a showrunner on a TV show.

[00:12:31] So can you talk about your relationship with those positions and what you do bring to the

[00:12:36] casting? I think we've been really lucky in working with Akiva and Henry and Alex.

[00:12:44] You know, after we did Disco, I think they sort of were like, oh, they get it, you know,

[00:12:49] and they sort of have been very open. I mean, we can speak specifically to Strange

[00:12:53] New Worlds when we read that script. And we definitely had certain ideas for some people,

[00:12:59] like we've talked about that were canon, but then the others were kind of all over the place.

[00:13:03] But I think both Margie and I, we look at things individually and then we'll call each

[00:13:08] other excited. Look at this girl, look at this guy. And if we both are passionate about

[00:13:13] the same person, it usually means we got something. And when we've gone to show the

[00:13:19] showrunners, we've been lucky in that they get what we see. There's been a couple times,

[00:13:25] right Marge, where we saw something very specific. I don't know how much we want to

[00:13:30] get into it. We can edit this out. There are a couple roles where we really got it very early

[00:13:35] on and, you know, to their credit or to their defense, they didn't see it yet. But we

[00:13:44] charged through and we got our girl. Nice. Are you talking about something specifically then?

[00:13:54] This is when it gets really kind of awkward to talk about what we do,

[00:13:59] you know, sort of the secret sauce of it. That, you know, we definitely go into

[00:14:07] strong persuasion mode, you know, if we're both really, really passionate about something.

[00:14:14] And then sometimes it's like bewildering to us that they don't get it. But I think this is true

[00:14:19] in the process of anybody who's good at our job, that you do end up doing a lot of persuading.

[00:14:27] And then yes, you do invite everybody to the party. You don't go to the party and later on,

[00:14:31] somehow you're looking at them, you know, talking about how much they love an actor.

[00:14:36] And Orly and I will be remembering, you know, how challenging it was to get there.

[00:14:42] Let's just leave it at that. Yeah, we're not here. We don't muck rake.

[00:14:46] We're not here like for gossip. We love saying no.

[00:14:48] No, I know. I know. And it's not, you know, and again, we see, you know, part of it is

[00:14:56] that we see hundreds and hundreds of people for each part, literally. And so when you

[00:15:03] get to the point, sometimes we get to it and we're so passionate because we see what other

[00:15:09] versions were and they don't have the time because they're doing everything else. You know,

[00:15:13] I mean, I'm sure every department has a version of this story. You know,

[00:15:18] this is the right set design. This is the right costume, you know, but it takes because

[00:15:24] you've spent the time getting to that place and your showrunners don't have the time because

[00:15:30] they're putting the whole thing together. But look, for the most part, we're very much in sync

[00:15:36] with them. Very cool. I suddenly feel much better about all the creative disagreements I have with

[00:15:40] Cameron and John. Yes. It's like, oh, that's how the professionals do it. Good to know.

[00:15:47] I know that you both were part of the process for Blue-Eye Samurai, which is a big favorite

[00:15:52] of mine. Is there something specifically different about casting for voice acting versus

[00:15:59] what you were saying before? Like, do you still look at acting first or do you look at voice

[00:16:04] first and maybe a sound and then try to pair the acting with that? Do you close your eyes

[00:16:08] when you do it? Right. Yes. Yes. I mean, or I have a picture of the character in front.

[00:16:17] I keep a drawing on a clipboard in front of me when I'm listening. And you're not closing

[00:16:25] your eyes because they do just send you voice tapes. Gotcha. So you're not looking at the

[00:16:30] actor. I mean, sometimes we know the actor, but it's really can you imagine that voice coming

[00:16:37] out of that drawing body? Gotcha. Yeah. So just real briefly, let's kind of talk about

[00:16:44] what got you interested in, whether it was movies or TV or acting and how you became a

[00:16:48] casting director. What's like your two minute bio? Let's start with Marjorie.

[00:16:53] Okay, let's start with Orly. They're both pointing at each other, audience.

[00:17:00] I grew up in the biz. So kind of apple tree story, dabbled in the acting more than

[00:17:08] dabbled went to school and all that good stuff. And then became one of those actors

[00:17:12] that got a job at a bar and made a lot of money and auditioned every other week and was bored.

[00:17:19] And my dad did a lot of TV, 80s TV. I don't know if you guys would be before eighties,

[00:17:25] eight is enough and Starsky and Hutch and Charlie's Angels and Gunsmoke. So I sort of

[00:17:30] was around the process for a really long time. And I just sort of loved sitting in the

[00:17:35] waiting room, in the casting waiting room and looking at all the faces. I was what, eight or

[00:17:41] 10, young and I would just have a game with my dad where I'd say the girl in the pink sweater

[00:17:47] got it right. Based on nothing. Just a vibe. We're just watching her in the room and it was

[00:17:54] just that's how it started. Okay, just became real interesting to me and the acting sort of

[00:17:58] fell to the side and casting. I felt that I was with actors and was using what I had learned.

[00:18:05] It wasn't like, oh, went to school for that. Didn't use that. And it just, it was always

[00:18:09] something that I think I was good at without knowing. And then sort of dived in and was like,

[00:18:14] this feels right. And I'm sorry, I feel like I dropped the ball on the research. What did

[00:18:18] your dad do on those? A writer producer. Okay. Yeah. Very cool. Yeah. So. Like everything else

[00:18:23] in our partnership, you know, I couldn't be more different from Orly. You know, it's,

[00:18:27] it's one of the things that's really great and I think makes it fun for us. But, you

[00:18:33] know, I grew up in the suburbs of New York. My dad was a plumbing contractor. My mom was a librarian.

[00:18:39] You know, nothing to do with show business. And, but we did go into New York and go to the

[00:18:45] theater along with all other cultural things. And I'm old so they would dump us at the movie

[00:18:49] theaters on Saturday afternoon and watch probably inappropriate movies. It was just like,

[00:18:55] whatever was playing, you get dumped off in the afternoon. So I loved, I loved watching the stuff,

[00:19:03] but I never imagined I could ever, ever would be a part of it. And I just stumbled on it,

[00:19:11] you know, kind of early days in New York, I never knew what I wanted to do. Ran into somebody

[00:19:15] who was working on a movie and she quit her job and, and it was looking for kids for,

[00:19:23] you know, flashback sequences that looked like the lead actors in the movie. And,

[00:19:29] and they had gone through all the agencies and she wanted to quit the job. And she said,

[00:19:34] just go in and lie and tell them you've been working with me and I'll give you my research.

[00:19:38] And I went in and I got the job. And I talked my way into all these schools in New York,

[00:19:44] which, you know, you could never do today. And, and I kind of had an eye for it. And,

[00:19:50] and I felt like I was good at it. And that's kind of how I started. And

[00:19:58] you could do with that then, I mean, it still astonishes me that people come to work for us

[00:20:03] that, you know, want to do this because I didn't even know what this was when I started doing it.

[00:20:08] That's great. Well, yeah. So since that time, you both have very impressive careers that yes,

[00:20:13] we could spend an entire episode on. So we're just going to kind of rapid fire through some

[00:20:17] of these credits. Some you've both worked on some you each have individually. So I'll,

[00:20:22] you know, I'll toss it to the appropriate person first off for both of you,

[00:20:26] what you think of when I mentioned say American gods.

[00:20:32] We're just going to laugh. Exactly. I think Bruce, Bruce's auditions, come on,

[00:20:38] you got to talk about Bruce's auditions. Cause again, this pre-sages all the

[00:20:42] Bruce's auditions were fun. Again, you have to remember we see so many tapes. And so for

[00:20:46] something to stop us in our tracks, it's got to be insane. Right. But Bruce auditioned and it

[00:20:53] was one of those things large, large, come here, come here, come here, you know, and he was

[00:20:58] auditioning in his kitchen in his flat. Right. And he had right. Marge is that what you're

[00:21:04] thinking? And he came back and came back and we kept working with him. 11 times,

[00:21:13] auditioned him in his flat. Orly got to know all his roommates,

[00:21:20] his closet. We changed clothes on it. I mean, Margie and I, I will say what I love about our

[00:21:28] partnership is we're both equally as passionate about being crazy and getting the person the

[00:21:32] job. So we will go into people's closets on zoom and pick out shirts and just know sort of

[00:21:40] what'll pop, you know, in addition to auditioning with them and working the scene a hundred times.

[00:21:45] But by the time we finished with, with Bruce, we knew every roommate's name. We knew what they

[00:21:50] were having for dinner. We would wait for them to do. It was bizarre. I mean, we really got

[00:21:55] as close to a person as you can on, on a zoom. And this is Bruce Langley. Yeah. And he

[00:22:00] never had to get on a tube. He never had to go like to the area, which at the time

[00:22:09] was really weird and unusual, you know, cause that was long before anybody. So Orly,

[00:22:17] them that follows them that follow. That was a cool indie I did. I do a lot of indies,

[00:22:25] so it's no money and get the biggest actor you can get go, you know, which is, which is

[00:22:30] always fun. Sometimes new directors in most of the time, great scripts, because I won't take

[00:22:35] them on if it's too, indies are so hard to do for so many reasons. But then that follow

[00:22:41] came out of Sundance lab. The writers came out of Sundance lab and they had attached

[00:22:47] Olivia Coleman. And so the minute I heard that I was like done, you know, everybody made

[00:22:52] $5 and people just kept coming to the table. And it was one of those, you know,

[00:22:59] I had one of my casting nightmares. I'm sure Margie's had hundreds of these, but where I lost

[00:23:06] an actor the night before and they were to be on a plane on a Monday. And the first scene up

[00:23:12] was with Olivia Coleman and the actor from London couldn't get their visa. And we were

[00:23:18] told he could. And it was one of those horrible, horrible moments where you're like,

[00:23:22] why did I believe this agent? And we had nobody and it was midnight. And I just basically said to

[00:23:29] the producers, we have no one you're going to have to trust me. If they go down, we all go

[00:23:34] down together. And the actor was Lewis Pullman, who I will always say that name, because he read

[00:23:40] the script that night. He read it on the plane, took a red eye. He landed first up with

[00:23:45] Olivia Coleman and he crushed it. And the producers had never seen him audition, had never

[00:23:49] seen him. He'd never done anything. And it was one of those things where you just go on instinct.

[00:23:54] What are you going to do? You know, it's an indie. You can't move the day. You can't,

[00:23:58] there's no money to do that. And he was fabulous and it turned out well, but that's

[00:24:04] one of, you know, that was a great piece. I love that film. Yeah. Wow. Marjorie, one

[00:24:09] sentence that encapsulates Avatar. How do you do that? That's unfair. I'm so mean.

[00:24:18] Ha gosh. Wow. You've got me speechless and that doesn't happen. Asking actors to be

[00:24:32] bolder than they have ever been in an auditioning situation. That's what casting

[00:24:39] Avatar is like. Oralee, you told me about this movie, indie film that has an amazing

[00:24:46] cast that I'm going to go check out that John knows about and recommended. Mr. Right.

[00:24:51] Mr. Right. Yeah, that was another indie that I did with Sam Rockwell and Anna Kendrick.

[00:24:56] And funny enough, I cast Anson in a really small role. I told you I was a fan. And

[00:25:03] that was an odd one, but bizarre. That would be my one word, a bizarre film that

[00:25:10] a lot of people know of it. And it's funny to me. I thought nobody has seen it. And yet

[00:25:15] who is it that knows it? Yeah, John, good on you. So I get emails about that one,

[00:25:21] but that was a fun one. Sam Rockwell's Sam Rockwell. Yeah. Well, then our last one

[00:25:27] actually comes from a caller. So let's play Newman. Hi, Open Pike Night. Newman the

[00:25:32] space hippie here from the Movies for Days podcast, giving a very heartfelt Christian

[00:25:37] Slater esque greetings and salutations to your fantastic guests, Marjorie Simkin and Orly

[00:25:47] Situitz, casting directors to the stars. I just want to give so much thanks and praise

[00:25:53] to y'all for the amazing work that you do. Obviously without what you do, we would not have

[00:25:58] the right actors in the right roles. And more importantly, we wouldn't have the right mix of

[00:26:04] actors because as you well know, it's like a good cocktail. It's all about the blend, baby.

[00:26:11] Marjorie, let me also add that looking at your IMDb list of awesome was intimidating to say the

[00:26:18] least. You have worked on so many films that I love from the era I was coming up and watching

[00:26:26] movies, The Score, Death to Smoochie, Little Shop of Horrors. But as a space hippie,

[00:26:32] I've got to ask a question about the casting process of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. Were

[00:26:39] there any last minute replacements? Were there any notable experiences from that process? And

[00:26:46] if I can get a procedural question in what is something that an actor can do right away in an

[00:26:53] audition to make you lean forward and go, ooh, okay. And flip side, what is something an

[00:26:58] actor can do within the first few seconds of their audition to make you just lean back and go,

[00:27:04] God, when is this going to be over? Newman the Space Hippie out.

[00:27:12] Okay. So Fear and Loathing, Terry Gilliam, there is no one more fun

[00:27:20] to do auditions with than Terry. And I will say that I am grateful that I was doing in-person

[00:27:30] auditions then, not because I think we would have ended up with any different characters,

[00:27:35] but just because the Hang with Terry in that context is so much darn fun. Terry actually

[00:27:44] would read with them and me. So he and I would read parts, different parts with the actors

[00:27:53] while they were auditioning. And that was super fun in terms of what an actor can do

[00:28:00] you just got to come in and do the work. Not, you don't have to entertain us. I think what makes us

[00:28:07] go, ew, is if somebody's trying to crack jokes or, you know, it's like we're all going to do

[00:28:13] the job. So just do your best shot. Be yourself. We'll sit up if you're one of the

[00:28:20] right people in the right parts. We don't sit up. You can be great. But it can be like

[00:28:28] Barry Kiyogan. He wasn't right for that part. He was remarkable, but he wasn't right for that

[00:28:33] part. So it doesn't mean you're not great, that you don't get the part. It just means

[00:28:38] or that there was anything you could do differently. It just means you weren't,

[00:28:43] you didn't fit that suit as Orly would. Agree to tape in your kitchen maybe that will happen.

[00:28:49] There you go. We're going to talk a little more specifically about Trek now. We had a

[00:28:55] write-in from one of our listeners, David Jones. Hey folks, it's David Jones hailing you all the

[00:29:00] way from the moon of Jagal. He was a background actor in episode eight of season two. My

[00:29:07] question for our guests is what was it like trying to cast everyone and doing all the

[00:29:11] logistics, especially for Discovery during the pandemic? Like as that all came about, what

[00:29:18] were some of the biggest immediate hurdles? Well, you know, we also had those hurdles

[00:29:22] for SNW. We were casting on Zoom. So funny enough, we didn't meet anybody from SNW in the room,

[00:29:31] which is unheard of at that time. Nobody knew how it was going to go. I mean, no chemistry

[00:29:36] reads, which means the actors are reading with each other. You know, we did the best we could

[00:29:40] on Zoom, you know, where you're side by side, but they didn't physically, you know, we're

[00:29:45] used to seeing people physically in the room engage with each other. There's a vibe there

[00:29:49] to see the chemistry. We really had nothing to go on other than, and it worked, which if you

[00:29:54] would have asked me, I kept saying to Margie, how are we going to do this? I just couldn't imagine

[00:29:58] casting series regulars without doing that. But so to answer that, we did that. Marge,

[00:30:07] if I'm not mistaken, I think we first met this Strange New World cast at the premiere

[00:30:12] in New York. Wow. That's right. We did. That's what we had not, except for a couple of people

[00:30:18] that we had known before, had not, can you imagine? I mean, we couldn't, I couldn't imagine.

[00:30:25] But so I know I answered that backwards because they were asking about Discovery. But in

[00:30:30] Discovery, I think we did meet people in the room. Am I wrong, Marge? We met the series

[00:30:36] regulars. We met them in the room. But once the pandemic started, obviously we went to tape.

[00:30:41] But Strange New Worlds, we did everybody on tape. And I had done another movie where I had done

[00:30:51] the chemistry reads on tape. And I wasn't worried about it because actually when we did Avatar,

[00:30:57] we could never get Zoe and Sam in the room together, the first one. Jim had Cameron

[00:31:04] cut together tapes with them. And I saw that you could do that and see people side by side or back

[00:31:12] to one after another and get a sense whether or not it was going to work. And you saw it.

[00:31:19] And so I knew it was going to work. My memory, and again, it's a while ago on

[00:31:26] Strange New World, we were talking about doing chemistry reads. But in the end, we didn't

[00:31:33] because the big one that we were going to do chemistry reads were Jess and Ethan because of

[00:31:39] that romance. They knew that romance was going to be happening. And then they all just fell in

[00:31:44] love with Jess so much that it was like nobody brought up the chemistry read. He said,

[00:31:48] aren't we going to do a chemistry read? I was like, they didn't ask. We know it.

[00:31:54] Let's go on. Let's move on to the next problem.

[00:31:58] And Trek has always been known for nailing the casting. Did you feel the weight of that

[00:32:03] responsibility when you got hired for Discovery and then Strange New Worlds?

[00:32:08] So we tell, do we tell them the secret now Margie? If I'm outing you Marge,

[00:32:13] you can edit this part. Between the two of us, neither a Trekkie. Neither one. Except for

[00:32:20] Margie's brother who's a huge Trekkie. But we were in the offices and they would come and

[00:32:25] tell us all this integral stuff. We were like, you know about Canon and TOS, which in a really

[00:32:31] strange way helped us except for the obvious sparks of it all. We didn't know who these

[00:32:38] people were, what their history was. So we kind of came to it in a very fresh,

[00:32:42] you know, status. We didn't know a lot about the history, which I think is kind of cool.

[00:32:49] Cool. It's one of the reasons I think that the shows cross over to audiences that,

[00:32:56] I mean it's great that the fans are happy with what we've done, but we think it also helps us

[00:33:02] and helps the cast be a cast that people who may not be fans can come to. And of course,

[00:33:09] you know, the writing and I'm going to say particularly in Strange New Worlds has sort of

[00:33:13] opened it up to make it user friendly for the non-fan as well as making the fans happy.

[00:33:23] And every once in a while I would pick up the phone and call my brother and go,

[00:33:29] he was also a big American Gods fan. He's like the secret resource.

[00:33:36] I'm going to make him listen to this because I keep telling him we talk about him but

[00:33:41] I don't think he really believes. Should we invite him on the show? Should we interview him?

[00:33:45] Yes. Let's call him up right now. Let's get him.

[00:33:49] All right. Well, we have another caller question from our friend, Zoe.

[00:33:54] Open Pike Night. This is the USS Cinema. Zoe Richardson, Captain Commanding. I must say

[00:34:00] that you have two of the finest casting directors in the industry today in Marjorie

[00:34:06] Simkin and Orly Situitz. Situitz? I'm sorry. I don't know how to pronounce either of these names.

[00:34:14] I've never actually heard them spoken out loud. At any rate, what I said stands. You are two

[00:34:20] of the finest. I am so pleased with what I've seen on Strange New Worlds with all of the

[00:34:26] actors that you've been able to attract to the show. And I got to ask people who know me

[00:34:33] that I really don't know how to ask questions. I'm a starship captain. I'm not a

[00:34:40] journalist, damn it. But here's my question. Of all the actors that you've been able to cast

[00:34:48] on the show, which actor or maybe which set of actors have surprised you the most?

[00:34:56] In other words, which actor's performance was completely different or totally unexpected

[00:35:04] from what you envisioned when you first cast them? That's my question. And oh, there goes

[00:35:14] the warp core. I'll have to end this chat. Richard's an hour. Oh boy, that's a hard one.

[00:35:26] We might need another hour for that. I mean, you talked about how sometimes the character

[00:35:30] is discovered after the person is hired. We either know because we've seen an audition.

[00:35:36] Again, I think this will not kind of understanding the process a little bit,

[00:35:41] or we know the work and we know what the showrunners are going for enough that it ends

[00:35:48] up being in the neighborhood of what you imagine it's going to be. There aren't really like-

[00:35:55] Huge surprise. Oh my God. Yeah, there isn't like we're being forced to cast people and oh my

[00:36:00] God, they're better than I thought they would be. And when you thought you were like, yeah,

[00:36:04] this person will be good. And then they get out there and you're like, wow.

[00:36:07] I mean, sometimes there's surprises in the auditioning process where you think,

[00:36:15] I don't know, could they do it? And then they do it and they're really good. And you're really

[00:36:20] happy. Bruce Horak who played Hammer, the character was blind and the showrunners wanted us

[00:36:27] to find someone who was visually impaired to play the part. When you hear something like

[00:36:35] that and it was a big part, you go, okay. And we were hoping to find somebody in Canada

[00:36:45] and we have a wonderful colleague there, Robin Cook, who works with us in Canada. And we reached

[00:36:52] out to her and she went, I don't know, I can't think of anybody. And she did a little homework

[00:36:57] and she said, well, there's one guy, but I don't know if he's going to be able to pull

[00:37:02] the part off. And so he came in, he auditioned and we saw something there and we spent time

[00:37:09] and we worked with him. And he did a really solid job in the audition. And then by the time he got

[00:37:17] to actually be playing the part on camera, I think he was fantastic. So that would be-

[00:37:23] That's a good one.

[00:37:25] It was fabulous and he's an amazing guy. And that was one of the great surprises and gifts.

[00:37:32] Whose idea was it to cast him as Garcock? Was that one of you or was that a showrunner,

[00:37:36] a writer?

[00:37:37] His second season role.

[00:37:39] No, then they were in love with him. We have a joke that no one ever dies in Star Trek,

[00:37:49] in disco, in the pilot there was a young actor and he was absolutely wonderful and died.

[00:37:58] And then, well, we have an alternate universe. Let's bring him back. Poor thing died again.

[00:38:04] But I think by then he was a series regular on another show. But it was really, no one ever dies.

[00:38:13] All right. Well, we have another call here, Grayson.

[00:38:17] Hello, Open Pike and Marjorie and Orly. Thank you so much for letting me ask this very

[00:38:23] behind the scenes-y question. And I hope I don't get too controversial here, but

[00:38:30] I am a very big fan of colorblind casting. I think with very few exceptions, any role can be played

[00:38:38] by any actor, especially when it comes to fiction. I think even established characters

[00:38:44] can be played by actors of other races or genders in subsequent productions with little

[00:38:49] or no explanation needed. I honestly cannot understand why some people are like,

[00:38:55] Robert April looked like a white guy in the animated series. So how can he be played by

[00:39:01] Adrian Holmes in Strange New Worlds? My enjoyment of Star Trek is over. I personally believe

[00:39:09] that colorblind, genderblind or sexuality blind casting can create incredible opportunities

[00:39:16] for a show or a creative property to grow. So my question is how much leeway does a casting

[00:39:23] director have? I'm sure there are cases when producers are looking for a very specific person,

[00:39:28] but in general, can you suggest any actor for any role? And are you seeing scripts that just

[00:39:35] say character is a lawyer, cop, unhoused person or whatever with no race or gender

[00:39:43] attributes requested at all? Thanks. Yes, but we do get specific alien

[00:39:49] species that are specified. So we do know what the particular species, you know, otherwise I think

[00:40:00] look, Star Trek is famous for its inclusivity historically, although I will say that when I

[00:40:09] went back and we were starting this project and I looked at the very first episode of the very

[00:40:15] first show as a woman, it kind of was skeeden to say the least. And I want to talk about

[00:40:26] women in Star Trek for a moment because Orly knows the story I'm going to tell. And I feel

[00:40:31] like over the years that we've just been doing these shows, it's been a real illustration of

[00:40:38] exactly what you're talking about. When we did the first episode of Dingo, I don't know how much

[00:40:46] anybody remembers, but at the very beginning, very first scene, you have two women, right?

[00:40:54] You have a captain and her first and it's Michelle and Sonequa. And there was a scene

[00:41:02] in the pilot where they then meet with an admiral. And we said, can't the admiral be a woman?

[00:41:12] And our showrunners at the time said, that's a lot of women in a scene.

[00:41:21] And I said to them, would you say the same thing if it was three men?

[00:41:28] And there was dead silence. I say this not to out them, but to say that was a manner of speaking

[00:41:36] and they thought we had a good point and they let us cast a woman as the admiral.

[00:41:43] And we went to the studio and the only note on the first reading of the pilot reading,

[00:41:53] the only note from the network was there are too many women in that scene.

[00:41:58] And we had to recast that admiral as a man. That would not happen today.

[00:42:05] So I really want to say that that is, to me, a really potent illustration of where we were

[00:42:13] then and where we are now. Because now, yes, the script say lawyer, whatever, whatever.

[00:42:21] Sometimes there's a story point. And if there's a story, there will be a gender specificity

[00:42:30] if it's part of the story. If it is a character, a big character from canon,

[00:42:38] I do think there would be even if we were starting it today, I don't know.

[00:42:44] You know, I think there was a feeling that certain characters had to be the same ethnicity.

[00:42:51] But we've certainly been allowed to and encouraged to stretch and it is a discussion.

[00:43:00] But if you are allergic to latex, you cannot play certain alien characters.

[00:43:09] So there's not entirely allergy blind casting, I guess.

[00:43:13] There is not an allergy blind casting.

[00:43:15] It's a safety thing, John.

[00:43:17] Yep. Well, with that, sort of a follow on, do either of you have any actors

[00:43:25] that you are just dying to cast in general or in Star Trek that you're just waiting for

[00:43:30] the right part to come across your desk for them?

[00:43:33] For the right suit to fit them.

[00:43:34] For the right suit.

[00:43:36] I love it. You know, we have a celeb trek list, if you will.

[00:43:44] That we keep handy because we'll be speaking to an agent about a different role and they'll say,

[00:43:49] hey, you know who's really who? You know, we just saw yesterday for lunch.

[00:43:51] They love Trek. And so right away we get our little celeb list out and, you know,

[00:43:58] one of the ones I always like and I always go back to,

[00:44:00] Margie, I think we went back to on section 31 was, you know, Obama is a huge trek.

[00:44:05] We haven't done that yet. Haven't gone there yet.

[00:44:07] But that's always number one on the list.

[00:44:10] But, you know, having said that, we do have that list.

[00:44:12] We do. We got Stacey Abrams.

[00:44:14] Yeah.

[00:44:15] Stacey. Yeah.

[00:44:17] So it doesn't specifically answer that question, but there are people on that list that we would

[00:44:21] love to incorporate at some point down the road. And there's some fun ones on there.

[00:44:26] Man, we love finding out a secret behind the scenes.

[00:44:28] Yeah.

[00:44:28] Documents. This is like the third one we found out about.

[00:44:31] It's just so fun to know they're out there.

[00:44:33] I'm going to be theorizing what that list is for probably the rest of my life.

[00:44:37] That is so cool.

[00:44:38] Under wraps.

[00:44:42] No, I mean, it's all based on stuff that's, you know, if we read an article and we read

[00:44:47] that somebody says it, it's researchable, Jesse.

[00:44:51] Is that a different experience for you having gone into the casting world of Trek to have

[00:44:57] like people coming up and say, I'm such a big fan of this franchise. Please let me be in it.

[00:45:01] I'm guessing that's maybe different than some of the movies and shows you've done in the past.

[00:45:05] No, for sure. For sure it is. I mean, again, like Marjorie saying, it's researchable because

[00:45:10] you'll hear somebody say something in an interview that has nothing to do with Trek

[00:45:13] and they'll just mention Trek and off we go and we explore. So for sure, it's different

[00:45:19] than other shows. I mean, there's fans of other shows, but the Trek universe, as you know,

[00:45:23] is so specific to that.

[00:45:25] That's so cool. Excellent.

[00:45:27] Yeah.

[00:45:28] We have another caller here from our good friend, Abby.

[00:45:31] Hey, hey, Open Pike, Marjorie and Orly. This is Abby Summer from the First Flight Podcast.

[00:45:36] I was just wondering as casting directors, how is it that you cast non leads? I'm a big fan of

[00:45:43] background actors, minor characters, reoccurring characters, all those other people that populate

[00:45:49] a show that aren't the leads. As much as I love the leads, those people really make it feel

[00:45:53] like a lived in universe. So I'm wondering if you could talk a little bit about how that happens

[00:45:58] and what you look for there and the balance between somebody who's going to do a great job

[00:46:03] and not overshadow what the main point of the story is. So I hope this finds all of you well

[00:46:07] and we'll talk soon.

[00:46:09] We don't actually cast the background. There are special casting director departments

[00:46:14] that do background extra work, which means to you listening, I'm sure you all know

[00:46:21] that they don't speak. So we don't do that.

[00:46:25] But what about guest stars, the smaller characters?

[00:46:29] It's really no different. You're still looking for somebody who, again, it's not going to be a

[00:46:38] thing. It's the suit. Each character has a purpose in the story and so we go about it with

[00:46:52] honestly the same intensity that we do this series regulars.

[00:46:56] The odd thing that happens in Trek is that sometimes if somebody is another species and needs to have

[00:47:09] special effects makeup done, then sometimes we have to cast them a long time before we even know

[00:47:18] fully what their role is because it takes 12 weeks to do something. So that becomes an

[00:47:28] interesting other effort and the showrunners will have somebody usually write a scene

[00:47:35] that is like or what they think this character would be doing and we use that for an audition

[00:47:41] scene. But other than that and the fact that they won't be allergic to latex comes like casting

[00:47:50] any other role no matter how big or small. Sometimes it's a budgetary thing so someone

[00:47:56] will have to come from Canada and then we use our good friends up there to help us

[00:48:01] sort through people that are up there that could be appropriate. But other than that,

[00:48:06] it matters to us tremendously that every single character be the right flavor, tone,

[00:48:14] piece of the puzzle, all of that stuff. I have such a nerdy question. What about like the Breen

[00:48:21] in season five of Discovery who are all wearing masks? Like do the ones who look like they're

[00:48:28] talking, do you guys cast them or are they all? That's background. That wasn't nerdy.

[00:48:34] That was a good question. Okay, well they're all wearing masks. I'm sure they're not like,

[00:48:38] are they talking? Yeah, so that's a bob their head like they're not right if they tilt their

[00:48:43] head a certain way. Does that mean they make scale or do they get it's not talking but also

[00:48:49] there are characters that don't talk but have to perform something and those those are in our

[00:48:56] wheelhouse as well. Okay, okay. Those those are part of you know, they're our problem

[00:49:02] as well. And again, and more likely come from Canada and you know, we trust those guys

[00:49:08] and they're fantastic that we work with. Well then just to nerd out specifically on one part

[00:49:13] of Discovery from this most recent season, let me say thank you so much for Callum Keith Renny

[00:49:18] as Rainer like absolute man Grand Slam seriously. That's another Orly special. That's another one

[00:49:28] you've nailed it about. If you only knew the Callum.

[00:49:34] The real Callum story. Yes. Thank you for saying that it means more than you know, Jesse.

[00:49:41] All of us are beating like Rainer is awesome. Callum Keith Renny is awesome. So yeah.

[00:49:46] Really super made that one happen boy. Yeah, very cool.

[00:49:52] We're gonna have to get you guys off mic to tell us some stories. Yes, exactly.

[00:49:57] We're gonna buy you a drink and get you drunk one of these times. Yeah.

[00:50:01] I think we've got one more caller. We do. We have Dalida. Hi, everyone. First of all,

[00:50:07] thank you very much for letting us ask a question to your guest today. And I do love

[00:50:15] the podcast. My name is Dalida Ines and of course, I do love everything is related to

[00:50:21] Star Trek. And my question is for Marjorie and Orly, when you cast new actors besides

[00:50:30] all the necessary requirements for any characters chosen, do you try to find that little things?

[00:50:40] It's like it's like an aura but it is not. I don't know how to explain it. But you can

[00:50:46] see it through the eyes of any actor. So or do you just realize it afterwards once you see it

[00:50:54] on the screen? So this I would like to know that that's that's my question. Thank you so

[00:51:02] much and enjoy the rest of the podcast. Well, I mean, I think that's what we've been

[00:51:07] talking about the whole time. That really is due. You know, that is the instance of doing

[00:51:13] the job is, you know, looking for an energy that works with the part that fits the suit.

[00:51:26] But also, you know, the thing about doing a series that's different than casting movies,

[00:51:33] a movie is an engagement and a television series is a marriage. And so it's about being

[00:51:42] with these characters, not just with actors, you know, like we were talking about originally

[00:51:46] with Ansel and his attitude about about it. But really characters that the audiences are going

[00:51:54] to love and want to be invested in. And of course, the writers are writing these characters.

[00:52:00] But what happens over time is they start writing for the actors and their abilities

[00:52:05] and their performances. And so what is so exciting and honestly, for me, heartwarming about hearing

[00:52:13] all these questions and comments from from your listeners is that it makes me feel like we did

[00:52:18] it or, you know, we we found people that people fell in love with. And and we do believe

[00:52:25] that that's that's why people come back. That's why we watch a series that we watch,

[00:52:29] because we've fallen in love with these characters and these actors in those roles.

[00:52:34] It's what we're always looking for people that we would want to see next week.

[00:52:39] That's correct. Speaking of that je ne sais quoi, I mean, even beyond that, we can say that

[00:52:44] of all the cast and crew that we've spoken with, like it is true, they are a special

[00:52:49] caliber of people. Everyone has been so generous and kind and just great people,

[00:52:57] people, it seems like. And I do wonder, like, do you consider that part that casting

[00:53:02] these people, they are going to be representing not just the series, but Trek as a whole. And

[00:53:07] they're going to be going out to conventions and meeting the fans and being ambassadors

[00:53:12] for this giant franchise. Is that at all come into your mind or is that

[00:53:16] too much and you just focus on the character? I think it comes into our mind,

[00:53:19] but it doesn't stop us from presenting people, you know, that are I'll say it

[00:53:24] fit the suit, you know, sort of tangent to that. I just wanted to I think we'd be

[00:53:29] remiss not to say when we cast, when both of us when we knew we were going to cast Spock,

[00:53:34] you know, like they they they whispered that to us at the end of season one.

[00:53:38] And Margie and I were like, we don't want to talk about that now.

[00:53:42] Huge thing to wrap our heads around the fans would be, you know, anything we had cast that

[00:53:47] to that point, that was the most recognizable role that we were going to have to deal with.

[00:53:52] And the day came and I just think this is a fun story that Marge knows very well. But

[00:53:59] Ethan came in like six times not knowing he was auditioning for Spock. Oh, wow. Can you imagine?

[00:54:06] I mean, six times auditioning for any role is hard, but not knowing we couldn't give him notes

[00:54:11] like, no, play it more illogical or, you know, we couldn't do any of that. And at first it was

[00:54:19] funny and it was like, I don't know what else to tell this guy, you know. But I think it

[00:54:23] speaks to again people coming back and back and back and doing the work because they wanted

[00:54:28] to for this show. And then you get lucky and they all are like family. We've heard from many

[00:54:34] of people from coming back and saying, wow, it's a really good group up there, you know.

[00:54:39] So I think you get lucky, but I don't think unless you know something very specific about

[00:54:43] somebody, I don't think you do worry too much about that, you know, in the casting process,

[00:54:49] unless you do know something that you need to address. But we've been really, really lucky.

[00:54:54] These are particularly challenging shows to do. I'm not, you know, with all due respect,

[00:54:58] if somebody is doing a procedural week after week, you know, this is grueling on another level.

[00:55:06] And, you know, I keep kidding about the makeup, but I'm not kidding about the makeup.

[00:55:11] And then all of a sudden we'll get a script and they're like, hey, everybody's going to be

[00:55:14] a whatever this time. And so if you don't have a good attitude, it's going to be

[00:55:21] a particularly trying thing. But you don't always know who people are going to be when

[00:55:25] you're doing, you know, they're nice to us because they're trying to get a job again,

[00:55:28] we're HR, you know, so there it's, we don't see the ugly and we know there are shows out

[00:55:36] there where there are ugliness. We've been very lucky that, and I think this is also,

[00:55:42] you know, speaks to the show runners that, you know, they have and particularly the

[00:55:48] producing directors who were up there for the long run and how they handle things,

[00:55:55] that they've turned these people into a family. And it's lucky. I mean, they are a really,

[00:56:00] really wonderful group. And occasionally for, I will say this about guest stars,

[00:56:07] if there is somebody who is fabulous for a part, and we know they're kind of a pill,

[00:56:13] we will say to them, we think they're right for the part. They will enhance it, but they're

[00:56:18] going to be a pill, but just suck it up because it's a short period of time.

[00:56:26] That's great. I'm picturing Carol Kane, right? She was just so hard to work with.

[00:56:34] Let's talk about Carol Kane real quick. How did she get cast?

[00:56:37] Yeah. Okay.

[00:56:40] Was she on your list of like, when you get a chance?

[00:56:42] She was.

[00:56:44] Was the list. She was, I mean, honestly, we read the script and then, and we were sort of

[00:56:50] batting, they were sort of explaining people that they thought could be right. And, you

[00:56:57] know, sort of said, what about Carol? And Akiva started to laugh on the phone at the idea

[00:57:05] of it. And they hadn't really, you know, it was like really hit his funny bone. And I didn't

[00:57:11] think it was that out there. The crazy thing is this shows you where I got, to me, it didn't

[00:57:17] seem that unusual of an idea. And it just made us laugh the idea of Carol in that world.

[00:57:26] And I think it's made the fans laugh. My brother really liked that one.

[00:57:31] And I mentioned it before, afterward. I mean, they even talked about it. And then after the first

[00:57:36] episode she was in, he called me up and went, Carol Kane? That's hilarious.

[00:57:42] She is the person we all didn't know we wanted to see in Star Trek in that role.

[00:57:48] Thank you.

[00:57:49] Well, that's our goal now. Now it's just about having fun. Now it's just about, you know,

[00:57:55] how interesting can it be? Because now people really want to do it. Especially,

[00:58:02] I mean, I don't think she was supposed to be around quite as long as she's in there.

[00:58:07] So I've got some specific character questions here. And full disclosure,

[00:58:14] I'm the huge fan boy. I have trouble containing myself every interview.

[00:58:19] The first time we met Anson Mount, I actually blacked out for like 15 seconds before I started

[00:58:25] talking. But since then we've spoken to him a couple times and you're right. Absolutely very

[00:58:32] nice guy. Easy to talk to. Really puts you at ease once you get past that aura. So I'll just

[00:58:40] start by saying, I don't think you have missed anywhere in this series. These people are the

[00:58:47] people that are supposed to be on this crew. It really does from you guys. That means a lot.

[00:58:52] Yeah, thank you. And so I mean, what's your research? Like you said, you watch people in

[00:58:58] stuff and you become a fan and then you get put into a position to put them in Star Trek.

[00:59:03] So with Anson Mount, I have to ask because this is a sticking point for me

[00:59:08] in the history of our show. Did you or did you not watch him in the Britney Spears movie?

[00:59:12] I'm a fan, but I missed that one. Me too. Of course I didn't. No, the answer is no.

[00:59:28] I think you can see shades of Pike in his performance in Crossroads. The first time

[00:59:33] I told my wife that he was in Star Trek, she went, oh, from the Britney Spears movie.

[00:59:36] And I was like, what? That's hysterical. I want to watch that now for sure.

[00:59:40] We'll do a group watch some point of these days. Absolutely. So was there anything that you had

[00:59:47] seen Ethan Peck in before he auditioned? That story is funny because like I said before,

[00:59:53] we were so sort of nervous about that and I always explain it to my friends. They're not

[00:59:57] in the business. It's like if I was a real estate agent, I showed you one house.

[01:00:02] You'd probably say that's a cool house. What else you got? Right. And so when Ethan came

[01:00:07] in the first day we started this role, it was sort of like, oh my, is that Spock? We had so much

[01:00:16] pressure on us for so long and we're dreading this just as far as it being so challenging.

[01:00:20] And he walks in the first day and we're like, no, that can't be. But it is. But wait,

[01:00:25] who else is there? And then it was one of those stories you hear where you just keep

[01:00:29] going back to him. It's like anything else in life when you're like, oh, it's the first

[01:00:34] house. It's the first dress, you know? But that's really what happened with Ethan

[01:00:40] and it was undeniable. Very cool. So, okay. You had mentioned Marjorie being a little skeeved

[01:00:48] out after you watched the original pilot. We have all been really grateful to get number

[01:00:54] one, Unichyn Riley back as a character and let her expand that legacy. Was there something

[01:01:01] about Rebecca Romaine that you had seen before that you, you know, before you put her in

[01:01:06] Discovery that made you think this is number one? In fairness, that was a tiny part that was

[01:01:13] never meant to become what it became. And she was friends with the showrunners at the time.

[01:01:21] That's how she ended up. She is one I will not take credit for here. Everybody wanted at

[01:01:25] that point to quote unquote cast up those parts, you know? And so it was like guess who we could

[01:01:32] get? She's friends with us. And I think it's been fantastic for her because she's really,

[01:01:38] you know, stepped up to the plate and gotten, I think, done, gotten an opportunity to do a

[01:01:45] level of work that frankly she hadn't before. And she's done a great job. It's been

[01:01:53] fantastic. And I think she's having a great time. But it was really originally just guess

[01:01:58] who we could get? And she looks like, you know, she kind of looked like the original.

[01:02:03] Yeah. Yeah. That, I mean, the courtroom episode from season two,

[01:02:07] like widely agreed to be an instant classic. So yeah. So yeah, yeah. The big three there,

[01:02:13] Captain Pike, Spock and number one, we've got the story and we have more legacy characters,

[01:02:19] but of the characters remaining, who would you say like when you were reading that script

[01:02:24] for strange new worlds, who was the character that you were most excited to get to cast?

[01:02:30] I'm going to go a different way here. How about that? Okay. Sure. Please. There was one

[01:02:34] character that was really hard to cast one series regular. It took us the longest and it

[01:02:41] was sort of not as defined in either Margie or my thinking when we thought about it. It was Lan

[01:02:50] and it was such a wide variety of what she, we knew what they wanted. We knew what they were

[01:02:56] going for, but she was the hardest to cast. We went to all countries, so many countries,

[01:03:03] we were in Israel, we were in India, we were in everywhere. There was so many almost,

[01:03:10] let's try it again with almost. And then Christina happened. But that was, wouldn't you say Marge,

[01:03:16] that was the hardest to cast? Because everything else was super distinct. The other character

[01:03:22] had very distinct qualities and she was less specific in the writing. You kind of immediately,

[01:03:32] you knew who Ortega was, you knew what that was. And then it was just who's the coolest

[01:03:37] person we could get. But you didn't know who Lan was. And yes, you're absolutely right. It took us

[01:03:47] a long time and then it became, it's that thing one of your callers was talking about. You're

[01:03:51] putting together a puzzle, a tapestry, a cocktail of all these different flavors.

[01:03:59] And it was sort of, we needed to fill the missing piece. And as we pieced it all together,

[01:04:05] we figured out what the missing energetic piece was. And then it turned out she had all these other

[01:04:13] talents. Who knew she could sing like that? She's just remarkable. But they're all remarkable.

[01:04:21] I love all my children. We were told frequently by callers and other fans,

[01:04:29] I was not sure about that character, Lan, when I first read that she would be in the show

[01:04:34] because I was thinking, how are they going to make that work? And the performance has

[01:04:39] absolutely turned everybody around on it. She's a huge favorite now and she's had great stories.

[01:04:45] I think as people, as they discover her strengths as a performer, they've written to her.

[01:04:51] Because that again is what happens as these things develop. But honestly,

[01:04:56] I have been fortunate enough to do a lot of things. And I will say with no hesitation,

[01:05:03] this is one of my favorite casts that I've ever been a part of putting together.

[01:05:09] They're just all rock stars and they're so cool. I really love every each and every one

[01:05:20] of them for their own special things. I think each one could carry a show on their own,

[01:05:24] could have their own spin-off. Which we've asked for and we will continue to ask.

[01:05:32] So with Uhura, I'm sure there was some pressure there. Had either of you seen

[01:05:39] Celia's stage work or was that just? Yes.

[01:05:43] Oh, okay. No, we both.

[01:05:45] Yeah. During the pandemic, I was watching as much Broadway as I could and there came Jagged

[01:05:49] Little Pill. And it was before we knew we needed Celia. But that's one of the things where it's

[01:05:57] like you're doing your homework and Margie and I both go to the theater and there wasn't any to

[01:06:02] go to. So it was sort of classic timing where there she was. And Margie saw the play live and

[01:06:08] I saw it over Zoom. And so that was a pretty cool moment. And I'm a huge fan of her mother's

[01:06:16] ass. To me, one of the biggest thrills of going to the premiere was meeting her mother.

[01:06:22] Because it's this huge Broadway star that we both seen a lot of and it was like,

[01:06:28] oh my God, she's mom here. But yeah.

[01:06:31] She talked a lot about her mom when she was on.

[01:06:35] So with Celia, do you reach out to Celia and ask them to audition then? Or what is the

[01:06:40] percentage of people who just auditioned on their own that you reached out to?

[01:06:47] It's hard to quantify because when we start, we're off in our corner making our little list.

[01:06:52] And at the same time, we reach out to the agents and say, who have you got?

[01:06:57] And then things come in and there's lots of crossover.

[01:07:01] It's sort of more that than it is, oh, you know who would be great.

[01:07:05] Okay.

[01:07:08] That happens almost more on the guest star front, you know, because we have less time.

[01:07:15] Because just like Orly was explaining about, you know, with Ethan, with the series regulars,

[01:07:24] you just kind of want to see everything because someone could walk in that's not

[01:07:28] like what you'd imagine the part to be and be amazing.

[01:07:33] You have more time to do that with the regulars than you do with the guest cast.

[01:07:37] For me, I think in season two, it really solidified that Mbenga is one of my favorite

[01:07:43] characters. I can't say absolute favorite because then I would feel bad for the other

[01:07:47] actors and characters. But for me, Babs, Alous and Mokun kind of came out of nowhere.

[01:07:52] Like I hadn't seen him in anything. And then he's in Star Trek and he's in Dude

[01:07:57] in the next Henry Cavill movie. I'm like, wow. So had you seen him in something or

[01:08:03] was he just part of the line of auditions? Both. We knew him and he was part and parcel

[01:08:13] of like we know him, we like him, let's see him, give it a whack, you know,

[01:08:17] and then that happens. That's amazing.

[01:08:20] I mean, I didn't know Chrissy, you know, but all of my friends who are casting

[01:08:27] directors in London, you know, were so excited that she got this part because

[01:08:31] they've all been fans of hers. And, you know, we're happy that she got this

[01:08:36] opportunity. And, you know, Babs was somebody we both seen and, you know,

[01:08:42] we're like, that's a great, you know, I think it did come in from the agent.

[01:08:45] But we both, we knew his work. But I'm saying that's one of the more fun,

[01:08:51] hilarious, I don't know if this translates audition, pandemic audition story.

[01:08:57] Talent. Now that I've seen this house,

[01:08:59] I know how hilarious. You know, we always get, we do this thing where we get on

[01:09:05] with the actors once we've seen the tapes and we've auditioned and we've read with

[01:09:10] them on Zoom. And when they're going to meet the showrunners, we want to make sure

[01:09:15] that we get a really great tape that we could then send to the network for

[01:09:21] approvals and to, you know, the Star Trek people and to Alex.

[01:09:27] And so we get on early to set up the shot.

[01:09:31] And there's often a lot of books involved and people like having to

[01:09:37] lift their computers so that the eyeline is exactly right and the light is exactly

[01:09:42] right. And they're moving around their house with the lights.

[01:09:45] And he was in this room and the lighting looked great, but it was too low.

[01:09:52] And we kept having him bring more and more and more books.

[01:09:56] And I, God knows. And we had no idea where he was.

[01:10:00] And then I think Orly, I'm sure it was Orly,

[01:10:03] it's always Orly about setting it up perfectly.

[01:10:06] It's like, could you step a little further?

[01:10:07] And he said, my knees are on the bed.

[01:10:10] I'm in a tiny room in an attic at the top of my house.

[01:10:15] And since he lives in one of the really old houses.

[01:10:18] So I think the room was a bed and filled the whole thing, a little bed.

[01:10:24] And teetering on the bed was this power of books that he kept having to go down,

[01:10:31] I'm sure, a very narrow staircase in this old house in London,

[01:10:36] up again with more and more books.

[01:10:38] And this thing was teetering on it.

[01:10:40] And we were both like, okay, just do it.

[01:10:44] But there was this ongoing thing.

[01:10:46] It was, I don't know, makes me laugh.

[01:10:48] It's very funny. Moral of story when you audition for us have a lot of books.

[01:10:55] That is our one tip.

[01:10:56] Yeah. And it goes back to what you said about,

[01:10:59] kind of just seeing that there is a willingness to do the work, even in the audition.

[01:11:06] It would be understandable for him to be like, can I please just read the lines?

[01:11:10] But it's like, you didn't get that.

[01:11:12] You had the dedication and the effort.

[01:11:14] That's a really great story.

[01:11:16] It's a great story.

[01:11:19] Okay. So everybody who listens to the show has been waiting for this.

[01:11:24] Tell us whatever you can about casting Melissa Navia as Ortega's

[01:11:28] absolute favorite here.

[01:11:30] She was our first interview.

[01:11:31] She really opened the door for us and we've since met her a couple of times.

[01:11:35] She's one of our favorite people in the world.

[01:11:39] Well, we didn't really know her at all.

[01:11:43] And she had a very remarkable rep who has come through for both of us in different things with

[01:11:52] fantastic actors, a smaller agency in New York.

[01:11:59] You know, it always impresses me when reps have an amazing, she has an amazing eye for talent.

[01:12:04] You know, everybody she represents.

[01:12:06] You come to trust people and when she says, can you see somebody?

[01:12:10] You know, I see them and she represents one of the kids that was an avatar

[01:12:16] and somebody that was in another movie that I did.

[01:12:18] And, you know, she represents a lot of people that the more mainstream places,

[01:12:24] you know, not they didn't go to a fancy drama school or they didn't pop from a this,

[01:12:30] that or the other thing, hot indie or, you know, and they just come in and she meets them

[01:12:35] and she thinks they're special.

[01:12:37] And so she asked us to meet her.

[01:12:41] And I'm going to say, I think from the minute we saw her, it was like

[01:12:45] a hundred.

[01:12:46] It was the way we had imagined the role.

[01:12:50] So, you know, we feel very lucky to have come across her.

[01:12:53] I mean, the humor and when that caller asked what makes you lean forward,

[01:12:58] it was just something that she just got, you know, she just had a take on this character,

[01:13:03] the humor, her energy, as you guys know, being fans just shines through.

[01:13:08] And it was something that was a leaning forward moment where we were like, yes,

[01:13:12] you know, nobody else was like her.

[01:13:13] Like Margie was talking about all the different flavors and she just completely

[01:13:17] embodied that character and brought so much to it that wasn't even just on the page.

[01:13:22] You know, there was so much that you can see when you watch tradition that she would have

[01:13:26] a lot of ideas about in future episodes.

[01:13:30] I can't wait for her to hear that.

[01:13:32] That's so cool.

[01:13:33] I mean, it does feel like just a special kind of magic that you have been able to

[01:13:38] capture with this whole cast.

[01:13:40] So with Jess Bush, had she been in something that you had seen or was that an agent or

[01:13:47] did she just kind of show up at auditions?

[01:13:49] I mean, I don't know how auditions work.

[01:13:50] Just as somebody when you hear cast directors talk about people they want to work with

[01:13:53] and find something for and hope to have something, it's what actors hate hearing.

[01:13:58] We're going to think about you for something else.

[01:13:59] We'll totally remember you.

[01:14:00] You know, it's like all those lines that actors have heard over and over and never

[01:14:04] believe.

[01:14:04] And what's fun for Margie and I is to say we meant it.

[01:14:09] She actually auditioned for us for Why the Last Man and got really super close and it

[01:14:14] didn't happen, you know.

[01:14:15] And we'll think about you for something else.

[01:14:18] She's supposed to do a film for me and it didn't work out.

[01:14:20] So when she heard back from us, she's like, uh-huh, right.

[01:14:23] You know, but that's somebody we kept our eye on.

[01:14:27] And there you go.

[01:14:28] You know, and it does happen for years.

[01:14:33] That really.

[01:14:34] And it really, and it's also again, this is, you know, there is a lot of, you know,

[01:14:41] work we do with certain reps that, you know, we trust.

[01:14:46] And she's somebody who, you know, her rep, an American rep found her in Australia,

[01:14:53] I think watching a television show.

[01:14:55] And as you know, she's an artist.

[01:14:59] And my memory of it is she was doing like Australia's top models to make money to

[01:15:07] pay for her art, you know.

[01:15:10] And he saw her on the show and saw how special she was.

[01:15:15] And, you know, it's really hard when someone doesn't have a fancy agent in their

[01:15:23] country of origin or whatever to sort of break through.

[01:15:27] And for us, if someone's special, if there's a rep that consistently shows us somebody who

[01:15:34] is special, then we take that call and see those people.

[01:15:40] You know, if somebody says, can you see these 23 actors?

[01:15:43] We're like, okay, maybe whatever.

[01:15:45] But if they say, can you see these two?

[01:15:47] They're really special for this role and this is why.

[01:15:50] Then those are the people you come to trust, you know.

[01:15:54] And that was the situation.

[01:15:57] They kept calling and hounding in a good way.

[01:16:00] You know, got anything for Jess?

[01:16:01] Got anything for Jess?

[01:16:02] And there you go.

[01:16:03] It just, you know, happens when the role is...

[01:16:06] And we saw this and we were both like, man, if we were going to...

[01:16:12] We go into mourning sometimes when we don't get our way.

[01:16:15] You know, we really do.

[01:16:16] We get despondent.

[01:16:18] And it doesn't happen often, but when it happens, it's horrible.

[01:16:25] It was like if Jess does not get this part, we don't know what to do.

[01:16:28] And actually, it was in the Jess and Ethan thing about the chemistry read, you know,

[01:16:35] because Akiba was like, you know, we have to do a chemistry read with whoever's going

[01:16:39] to play this part.

[01:16:40] And then he saw Jess and it was like, okay, she's...

[01:16:42] That's so cool.

[01:16:44] He was like, that was the one.

[01:16:45] It was like, that was the easiest...

[01:16:47] Thank God, because we didn't know where else to...

[01:16:49] I mean, we really...

[01:16:53] And I like that because you were mentioning earlier about, you know, sometimes it's not

[01:16:56] that you weren't great.

[01:16:58] It's just that there was one thing in the way and, you know, maybe it was another

[01:17:02] person, maybe it was a circumstance.

[01:17:04] But it's really cool to know that you're actually keeping people in mind when you

[01:17:08] say that you're going to keep them in mind.

[01:17:10] And I got kind of a slight detour here.

[01:17:13] I got to ask, like, how does it feel to know that you might be giving somebody

[01:17:18] their big break?

[01:17:21] Great.

[01:17:22] That's the fun of the job, right?

[01:17:24] That's what makes us keep going.

[01:17:26] You know, both on Disco and on SNW, we did that a lot, I think.

[01:17:30] And there's no better feeling, right?

[01:17:34] It's why I wake up and do what I do.

[01:17:36] I mean, that's the fun of it is finding...

[01:17:39] The fun of it is finding the right person for the part.

[01:17:43] Is the slotting, is the fitting the suit?

[01:17:45] Is that, you know, is the sort of like, yes, we got it right.

[01:17:48] And yes, they love that.

[01:17:51] And then on top of it that you give somebody an opportunity.

[01:17:57] And I think, you know, I know you were asking about 31 and we're not going to

[01:18:01] say anything because they'll kill us if we say anything.

[01:18:04] But I will say that I do believe and I may be proven wrong, but I don't think

[01:18:08] I will be.

[01:18:09] I do believe you will see someone that we are presenting to the world that the

[01:18:13] world doesn't know that will make everybody very excited.

[01:18:17] I'm already so excited.

[01:18:18] I'm going to like burst over here.

[01:18:20] Wow.

[01:18:20] Okay.

[01:18:20] That's a good tease, Marge.

[01:18:22] No kidding.

[01:18:23] I will say real quick, more than one actor who has come on and talked about

[01:18:28] us has mentioned you two and how great it's been working with you and how

[01:18:31] thankful they are.

[01:18:32] So, I mean...

[01:18:33] That's really nice.

[01:18:34] It doesn't go unappreciated.

[01:18:36] That's very cool to hear.

[01:18:37] You know, and we had so much fun casting Marty, Marty Quinn, right?

[01:18:42] There was another...

[01:18:43] He had done nothing.

[01:18:44] I mean, he was doing comedy in Ireland, right?

[01:18:47] He's doing sketch work.

[01:18:50] So that's the fun.

[01:18:51] It's like finding somebody, especially for those iconic roles where you're

[01:18:54] like, oh God, we're going to get killed if we do this wrong.

[01:18:56] So I have to ask another...

[01:19:00] I mean, we love Dan Janot who plays Sam Kirk.

[01:19:03] We've watched some of his Christmas movies recently.

[01:19:06] The dude is good at everything he does.

[01:19:09] Did you cast him based on the mustache?

[01:19:13] No, and again, I'm going to nod our wonderful team in Canada and Robin Cook

[01:19:20] and her folks.

[01:19:23] That was somebody who had a small part.

[01:19:24] I mean, he was coming in for a brief time.

[01:19:27] He was not staying for the party.

[01:19:29] Oh wow.

[01:19:30] And they liked him a lot.

[01:19:32] And so he has stayed for the party.

[01:19:35] I am so glad I like him a lot.

[01:19:38] He might be my favorite character.

[01:19:39] I love Sam so much.

[01:19:40] Yeah, and he's just an incredibly warm, genuine person.

[01:19:47] I've never met an actor I think that takes themselves too seriously,

[01:19:52] but Dan really has this air of like, oh, that's somebody you've met,

[01:19:57] somebody you'd know in real life.

[01:19:58] That's how Dan is.

[01:19:59] He's very sweet.

[01:20:01] So we have a legacy character here that is not a lead character yet,

[01:20:08] but when they tell you, okay, go find me a Jim Kirk,

[01:20:13] what goes through your head?

[01:20:14] That was the worst.

[01:20:15] I think that was the worst.

[01:20:16] I think that really for me because again, I am not,

[01:20:23] we are not Trekkies, but we knew Spock and we knew Kirk

[01:20:28] and we felt like we nailed it with Ethan and it was like,

[01:20:34] We have to do that again.

[01:20:34] Yeah, really.

[01:20:35] That was so fucked.

[01:20:36] Okay, for me certainly.

[01:20:39] I was like, are you kidding?

[01:20:43] That was horrible.

[01:20:44] It was horrible.

[01:20:45] It was horrible.

[01:20:49] No, I mean, I'm somebody who, I hate the idea of casting.

[01:20:53] I don't know how early we've never had this conversation with each other,

[01:20:56] but I don't like casting real people.

[01:21:00] Go find John Kennedy.

[01:21:03] Because everybody's going to be...

[01:21:05] Everybody has an opinion.

[01:21:07] And this was like that.

[01:21:13] This was like that and of course it all happened during the pandemic too.

[01:21:18] So that was a joy.

[01:21:22] It just was one of those things where it made sense to us

[01:21:26] and you kind of go, okay, it makes sense to us, but are we crazy?

[01:21:31] Because it is scary.

[01:21:32] It's a scary...

[01:21:33] Ethan was scary and then you're like, oh God dear Lord, now we have to do...

[01:21:37] And it was scary.

[01:21:38] It took us sleepless nights on that one,

[01:21:40] but it just came about and just felt really, really right.

[01:21:46] And it's just always that great call where you're like,

[01:21:48] okay, we're not cuckoo.

[01:21:49] They get it.

[01:21:50] Oh my God, dear Lord, they get it.

[01:21:51] Thank God.

[01:21:52] I mean, they're almost synonymous, right?

[01:21:56] You know, Shatner and that part.

[01:21:58] So it's there and you don't want to copy that.

[01:22:04] You don't want someone who's going to imitate, right?

[01:22:06] That's not...

[01:22:07] They have to have an essence.

[01:22:10] And so you kind of go, all right, well, what is the essence

[01:22:13] and what is the essence of a younger version of that?

[01:22:16] You know, like who is he before we first met?

[01:22:19] And it's somebody has to have that sense of humor and has to have...

[01:22:28] Sarcasm, confidence, all of it.

[01:22:31] Yeah, all of that stuff.

[01:22:36] We were on a jury together.

[01:22:39] Wait, what?

[01:22:41] Not a...

[01:22:43] It was a film festival jury.

[01:22:44] During the pandemic, we were on a film festival jury together online.

[01:22:52] And what we had to deliberate, we had to watch all of these...

[01:22:55] He's Polish.

[01:22:56] And so we had to watch all these Polish movies and then deliberate and pick the winners.

[01:23:03] So when we met him on camera, I went...

[01:23:07] Oh my God, I know you.

[01:23:08] I really like how you put that Marjorie about how it kind of felt like casting a real person,

[01:23:16] because I mean, even just as a fan, there is no way we could pick somebody that would work

[01:23:23] for that because it's like, how do you separate those pieces in your head?

[01:23:28] So yeah, that and then just casting on essence, like you said.

[01:23:33] There is serious magic going on in Yael's office.

[01:23:39] On your old phone calls.

[01:23:41] We don't have an office anymore.

[01:23:43] Did you ever see that photograph of him with Shatner?

[01:23:46] Do you know that?

[01:23:47] Yeah.

[01:23:48] On the airplane, right?

[01:23:50] So he like texted and said, you're not going to believe who I sat next to on the plane today

[01:23:56] and I can't tell him.

[01:23:58] Oh, I didn't realize he couldn't tell them.

[01:24:00] Well, Shatner doesn't have an NDA cam.

[01:24:04] Right.

[01:24:04] Well.

[01:24:05] No, but it was all...

[01:24:07] Yeah, and it was all...

[01:24:08] Yeah, right.

[01:24:08] That's funny.

[01:24:09] I didn't know that part.

[01:24:10] That's hilarious.

[01:24:12] So cool.

[01:24:13] All right.

[01:24:13] Well...

[01:24:14] And so Shatner just thought he was this goofball and trying to take pictures.

[01:24:18] Oh, I mean, he's not wrong, but no.

[01:24:22] How many people try and sneak a selfie with Shatner when they're in public anyway?

[01:24:27] He's got to be used to it.

[01:24:29] So I promise we're not asking for any favors here.

[01:24:33] I'm just...

[01:24:34] In general, what would be your advice to anyone listening who would love to be on Star Trek someday?

[01:24:43] Find one of those reps you were talking about.

[01:24:47] Get tested for latex allergy?

[01:24:50] All of the above.

[01:24:52] For sure.

[01:24:55] Start working the film festival circuit.

[01:24:58] Yeah.

[01:24:59] You never know.

[01:25:00] Buy books.

[01:25:03] Okay, I'm just going to say do good work wherever you get to do it.

[01:25:09] And if it's the right part, it just sort of bubbles up.

[01:25:17] You find the...

[01:25:19] You emerge.

[01:25:21] I mean, there's lots of actors we love and we don't have parts for them.

[01:25:25] You know, lots and lots and lots.

[01:25:29] It really is lightning in a bottle when it just all makes sense and it all just happens.

[01:25:34] There's no formula, right?

[01:25:37] Unfortunately, or we'd be billionaires.

[01:25:42] Mention in interviews that you want to be on Star Trek.

[01:25:44] Yeah.

[01:25:44] Exactly.

[01:25:45] If you're already an actor, make sure to mention that.

[01:25:49] Well, we aren't on Star Trek, but we are on Open Pike Night,

[01:25:53] which is an open Mike night themed podcast.

[01:25:56] So I believe Orly, you have been assigned as our joke teller for tonight.

[01:26:01] Is that true?

[01:26:02] Oh dear Lord.

[01:26:03] Well, I did just speak to my nieces.

[01:26:07] Thank God because it's always like, do you know a joke?

[01:26:09] No, and I can't even remember jokes, but I'm going to try one

[01:26:12] and you tell me if it's funny and you can edit it up.

[01:26:14] I have two.

[01:26:17] What...

[01:26:17] Hold on.

[01:26:18] I have to remember.

[01:26:18] See here it goes.

[01:26:19] What did the fish say when they slammed into the wall,

[01:26:24] when they swam into a wall?

[01:26:26] How about that?

[01:26:27] What did the fish say when he swam into a wall?

[01:26:29] Damn.

[01:26:31] I actually got it right before you said it and then I felt dumb.

[01:26:34] See, we'll see that's not true.

[01:26:36] I loved it.

[01:26:38] Wait, I have to try one more because it's funny

[01:26:40] and I'll never remember these jokes again.

[01:26:44] What do you call a hippie's wife?

[01:26:47] What?

[01:26:49] What do you call a hippie's wife?

[01:26:50] Mississippi.

[01:26:54] Nice.

[01:26:55] We'll edit in a rim shot there.

[01:26:57] That was very illusive.

[01:26:58] There you go.

[01:26:59] That was a rim shot.

[01:27:03] All right, well you said you can't give us a tease for section 31,

[01:27:06] but they did give us a great tease and we understand because it's section 31.

[01:27:09] But how about Strange New World Season 3,

[01:27:12] a single word that won't spoil anything?

[01:27:16] Yeah, so examples that we've had,

[01:27:18] we always ask for an out of context teaser, right?

[01:27:20] Like something that when you hear it, you're going to go,

[01:27:22] that's not a teaser.

[01:27:23] And then when you hear it or see it on screen,

[01:27:25] you go, I can't believe they told us that.

[01:27:29] So examples that we had were terrarium

[01:27:34] and what else have we had for Season 3?

[01:27:36] We've had mortegus.

[01:27:37] Mortegus, yes.

[01:27:39] Which we kind of expected.

[01:27:41] That was a gimme.

[01:27:42] I mean, I love Chrissy's which was just dun dun dun.

[01:27:46] Right.

[01:27:48] And again, never the goal to ask anybody to break an NDA or get in any trouble.

[01:27:55] Ugh, I'm completely blanking.

[01:28:01] Yeah, yeah.

[01:28:02] I mean, this isn't specific, you know, magical maybe?

[01:28:08] Okay, we'll take magical.

[01:28:09] That's good.

[01:28:10] Take that all day.

[01:28:12] Thank you.

[01:28:14] Yes.

[01:28:15] Well, I was going to say, you know, surprise.

[01:28:17] See, there you go.

[01:28:18] There we go.

[01:28:18] Okay.

[01:28:20] I like these.

[01:28:21] These are really good.

[01:28:23] So there's a magician's birthday party.

[01:28:25] Yep.

[01:28:26] Right.

[01:28:27] Okay.

[01:28:27] They turn everybody into aliens wearing latex.

[01:28:30] We've totally got this.

[01:28:31] Why are you going to get in so much trouble they know the whole log line?

[01:28:39] They figured it out.

[01:28:41] Drats.

[01:28:42] Did it.

[01:28:43] Henry, I feel like Henry gave us the most blatant one of anyone too.

[01:28:46] What did Henry say?

[01:28:48] For season two he gave us Orion cocktails.

[01:28:51] Yep.

[01:28:52] Oh.

[01:28:53] I believe...

[01:28:57] Dan Janak and Shang Dai.

[01:28:59] Yeah.

[01:28:59] I don't remember.

[01:29:00] Somebody gave us charades and when they gave it to us they didn't know that that

[01:29:04] would be an episode title.

[01:29:06] And then when we saw that list we were like...

[01:29:08] Wow.

[01:29:09] Oh, funny.

[01:29:10] Yeah.

[01:29:12] But yeah, this was...

[01:29:13] We get all sorts.

[01:29:13] We love them.

[01:29:14] Yeah.

[01:29:15] Because you never know which ones...

[01:29:16] Which one's going to hit.

[01:29:17] Right.

[01:29:18] Yeah.

[01:29:18] And because of the timing like season two was just about to come out when we were

[01:29:22] doing a big chunk of our interviews so...

[01:29:25] It's so funny because you just...

[01:29:27] I mean, I still get confused about what's in what season.

[01:29:31] It's just the timing of these things.

[01:29:33] You know, we're just going...

[01:29:34] I mean there was a minute where I went...

[01:29:35] We haven't done season three yet.

[01:29:37] And then I went, wait, no, we finished season three.

[01:29:40] It's incredible when you guys...

[01:29:41] When we talk to people like you it's like you guys know so many details.

[01:29:45] I don't even have them all in your...

[01:29:46] And then it's coming out and then it's...

[01:29:48] You know, but now it's not going to come out until...

[01:29:51] Another year?

[01:29:52] Whatever.

[01:29:52] Right.

[01:29:53] Yeah.

[01:29:53] Now I know it's really unfair where I was asking people questions about

[01:29:56] things that happened two years ago.

[01:29:58] Oh yeah.

[01:29:59] Well, it's your job.

[01:30:00] And we try very hard.

[01:30:02] And we try very hard.

[01:30:03] Thank you for not asking me more about Avatar.

[01:30:06] Yeah, I finished eight years ago.

[01:30:08] The one that's going to come out next year I finished working on eight years ago.

[01:30:12] That's not good.

[01:30:13] So in the Sylvester Stallone movie Daylight in 1996,

[01:30:17] how was it casting Viggo Mortenson?

[01:30:18] That's what I'm better at.

[01:30:20] I love that movie.

[01:30:21] There's some good stories on that one.

[01:30:22] Yeah, there were good stories.

[01:30:24] I want to talk about 12 Monkeys, John.

[01:30:26] Come on.

[01:30:26] Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

[01:30:27] I would choose 12 Monkeys for sure.

[01:30:29] I wish they would let us do.

[01:30:31] Now we're going to ask them to let us do some stuff on Blue Eye.

[01:30:34] Oh yeah.

[01:30:35] There you go.

[01:30:37] And thanks for watching Blue Eye, Jesse.

[01:30:38] Oh my gosh.

[01:30:40] I have been proselytizing that.

[01:30:43] Telling people they have to watch it.

[01:30:46] It's doing really well.

[01:30:47] People love it.

[01:30:48] People found it.

[01:30:49] I did it in a night.

[01:30:50] You see it.

[01:30:51] Love it.

[01:30:52] Yeah.

[01:30:53] But getting people to watch, I find,

[01:30:56] a lot of my friends are like, I don't watch cartoons.

[01:30:58] Right.

[01:30:59] I don't want.

[01:31:00] And they're like, that's the biggest barrier is telling people, look,

[01:31:03] animation is not a genre.

[01:31:05] It is a medium.

[01:31:06] Please go watch it.

[01:31:08] I definitely clicked on it thinking,

[01:31:10] okay, I'll watch this first episode and if I like it, I'll keep going.

[01:31:13] I finished it in a night and then I've been talking about it ever since.

[01:31:18] It's interesting the range of ages that in my experience,

[01:31:23] watch it from teens that love it to, you know, adults.

[01:31:29] It's amazing.

[01:31:30] And I believe the second season has been announced.

[01:31:33] So I am waiting on bated breath.

[01:31:35] I hope that show goes.

[01:31:36] Yeah, as are we.

[01:31:41] Any Star Trek people in Blue Eye Samurai other than the obvious?

[01:31:44] We'll find out.

[01:31:47] Blue Eye Samurai meets Star Trek.

[01:31:50] Maybe.

[01:31:51] Open Samurai night.

[01:31:52] I don't even need you guys for that one.

[01:31:54] You can take the night off and I'll just do the whole thing.

[01:31:58] True that.

[01:31:58] Marjorie and Orly, thank you so much for spending this time with us on Open Pike

[01:32:03] Night.

[01:32:03] It has been fantastic to learn more about what you do and what you have done for Star Trek

[01:32:08] Discovery and Strange New Worlds.

[01:32:10] Happy to be here.

[01:32:11] It was so much fun to talk to you guys.

[01:32:13] Really fun.

[01:32:15] Really, really fun.

[01:32:16] It's been a delight.

[01:32:17] Thank you so much.

[01:32:17] Yeah.

[01:32:18] And we can't wait to see what you will do going forward.

[01:32:21] Yeah, exactly.

[01:32:22] Strange New Worlds and the Star Trek universe as a whole.

[01:32:26] Thank you again.

[01:32:26] Thank you guys.

[01:32:27] Thanks.

[01:32:28] Thank you to all our listeners and callers.

[01:32:31] Those were fantastic questions from Marjorie and Orly.

[01:32:34] Thank you to Marjorie and Orly for guesting with us and to all of our supporters on

[01:32:39] Patreon and out there in the listening audience.

[01:32:42] Be sure to follow us on all social medias at Open Pike.

[01:32:46] Go to openpike.substack.com to sign up for the newsletter.

[01:32:49] If you haven't already, we will be putting out calls for more calls to our show for

[01:32:55] each episode.

[01:32:56] Be sure to follow Cam at GreenShirt87 for the Green Shirt, a newbie's trek through

[01:33:01] the next generation podcast.

[01:33:03] He is halfway through season seven and into DS9.

[01:33:07] If you have not heard the DS9 Minute, it is fantastic.

[01:33:11] Keep listening to Open Pike for more great interviews and discussion about Star Trek

[01:33:15] Strange New Worlds and all things Trek, including coverage of our panels at Trek

[01:33:20] Long Island 2024.

[01:33:22] It's been a long night and we have to go find the perfect people to cast for the

[01:33:26] Open Pike Night biopic.

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