OPN - Disco Inferno Episode 5 - “Saints of Imperfection”
Open Pike Night - A Star Trek Strange New Worlds ShowDecember 17, 2024x
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OPN - Disco Inferno Episode 5 - “Saints of Imperfection”

GOO RAVE! GOO RAVE! GOO RAVE! GOO RAVE! GOO RAVE! GOO RAVE!

Wynde Priddy, esteemed producer of the Greatest Trek podcast, joins John, Cam, and Jesse to discuss the goopy-est episode of Discovery yet! 

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[00:00:09] Is this thing on? Hello? Hello? Welcome to Open Pike Night and our special coverage of Discovery Season 2, Disco Inferno.

[00:00:32] We are here tonight to discuss Episode 5, Saints of Imperfection. And I'm joined of course, as always, by my co-hosts,

[00:00:40] the man who definitely would be portrayed in an old-timey painting carrying his own head, Jesse Bailey.

[00:00:47] I'm doing it right now, you just, you can't see because it's audio. And let me tell you, this thing is huge!

[00:00:54] And the man who is so dedicated to podcasting, he definitely considers offing his entire family just so he has less responsibility.

[00:01:02] Host of Green Shirt and Newbies, Jack 2, The Next Generation, Cameron Harrison.

[00:01:07] Hey, that's me. And just remember when John Bolz tells you you only have 10 minutes left,

[00:01:11] or when John Bolz tells you that time is up on recording, you really have about 10 more minutes to talk or so.

[00:01:16] No, it's not a big deal.

[00:01:18] And we have a very special guest tonight, somebody who makes another Star Trek podcast,

[00:01:23] possibly the most famous Star Trek podcast, sound even better. We are joined of course by the saint herself, Wendy Pretty.

[00:01:32] So somebody said something about there being a monster in need of killing? I'm here to help.

[00:01:40] Well, we're glad to have you here.

[00:01:42] Wendy the monster slayer.

[00:01:43] Yes.

[00:01:43] Yeah. And of course, we are talking about, Wendy is the producer of Greatest Trek, whose hosts Ben and Adam were our guests for the Crossroads coverage here in the last episode. We hope you all enjoyed that.

[00:01:54] I know they did.

[00:01:56] Yeah.

[00:01:56] I have it on good authority that a lot of people did enjoy that, John. And I think folks were a little surprised how much everybody on the show really enjoyed that movie.

[00:02:05] I was, you know, obviously not there for the recording, been a little busy on my end, but I was just surprised that it's taken this long for all the truth about Cam's personal beliefs to come out.

[00:02:15] I mean, come on. We learned some things.

[00:02:19] I'm here, here for the nerds.

[00:02:23] And we are here to discuss episode five, Saints of Imperfection. And, uh, Wendy and your emails to us back and forth, you said, this is a weird episode. And that I think is absolutely a great place to start.

[00:02:36] Yeah. It's a trippy app, right? Gets a little blacklighted for a lot of it.

[00:02:41] You know, with a season, with all of this weird technology stuff going on, spoiler alert, there are nanobots coming up. Are we absolutely sure that Michael is not a T-1000? Because she runs exactly like a T-1000.

[00:02:58] Oh, I was going to say she was going to, she was Tom Cruise running, and then I was wondering what, what, what sort of stunt Tom Cruise would do in the Star Trek universe if they're still making Mission Impossible movies in 300 years.

[00:03:10] She's going to jump off of a moon onto a planet.

[00:03:13] Yeah, yeah.

[00:03:14] On a motorcycle.

[00:03:16] Yeah.

[00:03:17] She looked a little bit like a gymnast, like running for the vault.

[00:03:20] Yeah, she has, she had good form. I do, but I do, like, is that, are you supposed to do that? Like, does that make you more aerodynamic to do the hand blades thing?

[00:03:29] You got to keep it all tight, you know?

[00:03:31] Yeah.

[00:03:32] It makes you feel more aerodynamic. It makes you feel like Tom Cruise.

[00:03:35] But it also, you got to put the brakes on extra hard when you turn the corner to get into engineering or the science lab. Like, like she would have skidded there if she had to time that skid perfectly. We didn't get to see that, which is too bad.

[00:03:48] I also want to remind everyone what's happening between the scene and where we left off last episode is Michael Burnham was in med bay going, oh my fucking God, Saru, I don't have to kill you. This is amazing. You're going to live. Everything is great now.

[00:04:02] What, oh, what's that? Oh, I've got a message coming. One second. What, what? Oh, Tilly's dead? Oh, okay. Thanks. So that's where Michael is right now. Her headspace is just all over the place.

[00:04:12] That's actually good context because as we've discussed, if you don't watch these episodes like in a row, it can be difficult to know where you are. Even with the full 90 second recap of the rest of the season, it's like, okay, so which of those plots are going to come into play in this episode? Spoiler alert, not most of them.

[00:04:34] Yep.

[00:04:35] Well, so I, and that's what I'm, you know, I kind of touched on this before about how we're kind of jumping around the plots and it does make it hard to follow episode to episode, but I'm realizing now it is kind of crazy how they're structuring the season.

[00:04:46] I think they're structuring it to your point, Jesse, like one big long episode, because we talked about how the first couple episodes are really laying in this red angel plot.

[00:04:54] And then all of a sudden you jump to Klingons and section 31.

[00:04:57] That's nothing really to do with what happened before.

[00:05:00] And then the episode following that is nothing about the Klingons.

[00:05:04] It's all about Saru basically evolving into his newer self.

[00:05:09] But this episode, the following episode has nothing to do with that.

[00:05:12] Now we're going back to the Klingons and section 31.

[00:05:14] But I do know that the next episode does involve Saru.

[00:05:17] So really they're just hopscotching every episode, which just seems like a bizarre way to structure a season.

[00:05:23] That makes you interested, Cameron.

[00:05:24] Man.

[00:05:25] Yeah.

[00:05:25] I mean, even Jet Reno.

[00:05:27] But when you're watching him two or three weeks apart, it's hard to follow.

[00:05:29] Even Jet Reno was in the scene where the thing ate Tilly, but Jet's not there in the scene in the spore.

[00:05:38] She's like, peace out, guys.

[00:05:39] That's too much even for me.

[00:05:40] I mean, Saru, like you said, Cam, he's barely in this episode.

[00:05:43] Like he's on the bridge, but man, he gets two lines.

[00:05:47] He just went through a life changing.

[00:05:49] Yeah.

[00:05:49] Like get your ass back to work, Saru.

[00:05:51] We got a problem.

[00:05:54] I'll say right now, I guessed wrong.

[00:05:56] When they were like, hey, we got Spock shuttle.

[00:05:58] I was like, oh yeah, Cam's going to be proven so wrong.

[00:06:00] I said episode five, we see Spock.

[00:06:02] I was like, damn it.

[00:06:04] Damn it.

[00:06:04] I don't remember the show well enough.

[00:06:06] They're carefully, carefully withholding Spock.

[00:06:08] Yeah.

[00:06:09] Yes.

[00:06:10] And I still maintain it will be the midpoint when we see him.

[00:06:13] So I think season seven, episode seven.

[00:06:15] I think episode seven.

[00:06:17] Okay.

[00:06:17] Here we go.

[00:06:18] Oh, yep.

[00:06:18] Nope.

[00:06:19] Yep.

[00:06:19] Nope.

[00:06:20] All right.

[00:06:20] But I'm never disappointed to see more Georgiou personally.

[00:06:25] Oh man.

[00:06:25] And I love.

[00:06:27] She can make an entrance.

[00:06:28] Exactly.

[00:06:28] Like no matter what she's doing, it's effective.

[00:06:31] It's powerful.

[00:06:32] The screen presence is off the charts, but I really like that we get what I'm going to

[00:06:38] affectionately call Tor P.O.V.

[00:06:40] in this episode, the Torpedo P.O.V.

[00:06:44] I mean, that makes sense, right?

[00:06:46] Because we got that in our first Gorn episode of Strange New Worlds.

[00:06:50] It's a nice little visual language tie in where you follow the torpedo out of the bay.

[00:06:55] And yeah, I'm, I have a lot of notes on this episode.

[00:06:59] We probably won't get to them all because there are a lot of them, but I really like that.

[00:07:03] I mean, I'm a sucker for a pew pew and you guys know that, but this series continues to

[00:07:10] be visually just a feast all the way through.

[00:07:14] There's your Thanksgiving joke for the week.

[00:07:16] Yeah.

[00:07:16] To Wendy's point, I thought I was on a mini golf course when we went down to the mushroom

[00:07:20] world.

[00:07:21] Oh man.

[00:07:22] With all the black lights.

[00:07:24] That's the type of mini golf I could just say.

[00:07:25] That's the one here in Portland.

[00:07:26] Sorry.

[00:07:26] It's an underground black light.

[00:07:29] I know not all.

[00:07:29] It's a little like Meow Wolf aesthetic.

[00:07:31] Yep.

[00:07:31] Yeah.

[00:07:32] Knowing what I know about Cameron, I assume the mycelial network would be his favorite

[00:07:37] place in the Trek universe.

[00:07:38] It's very slimy and neon, like some kind of goo rave.

[00:07:42] And I, I feel like Cameron would just enjoy that space.

[00:07:47] Well, you know, I always love visiting the mushroom kingdom where a monster Bowser is

[00:07:52] attacking all of the mushroom folk, all the toadstools.

[00:07:54] And if you touch them, you die.

[00:07:56] And then apparently also when you die, you just resurrect there.

[00:07:59] So it's the mushroom kingdom.

[00:08:01] Wow.

[00:08:01] This really is a Mario episode.

[00:08:03] Wow.

[00:08:03] So is Tilly the princess or is May the princess?

[00:08:07] Ooh.

[00:08:07] I think, well.

[00:08:09] Colbert?

[00:08:10] Yeah.

[00:08:10] I don't know who the plumbers are.

[00:08:12] Is Stamets a plumber?

[00:08:13] Yeah.

[00:08:13] I would say Stamets and Burnham are the plumbers in this case.

[00:08:15] Yeah.

[00:08:15] Yeah.

[00:08:15] Okay.

[00:08:16] All right.

[00:08:16] But Burnham is Luigi, right?

[00:08:17] Because she's taller than Stamets.

[00:08:19] Oh, 100%.

[00:08:19] Yeah.

[00:08:20] Okay.

[00:08:20] Yeah.

[00:08:20] Yeah.

[00:08:21] The best character.

[00:08:21] I'm suddenly having way more fun now that I assume this episode is a Mario parable.

[00:08:28] It works.

[00:08:28] This face that we get from Pike when Georgiou says, it's an invigorating ride.

[00:08:34] It's definitely like, is she flirting with me?

[00:08:38] I can't tell.

[00:08:38] But his intuition is always masked with this down-home demeanor.

[00:08:44] And that's kind of confirmed in this episode to be something he's completely aware of and

[00:08:49] is actively employing for his benefit.

[00:08:52] And it's not just some quirk of personality, right?

[00:08:55] Like, he knows how he comes across and he uses that to kind of belie how aware of the

[00:09:01] entire situation and the people around him that he really is.

[00:09:05] I think he tells Michael, you can call me provincial, but I feel this way.

[00:09:09] And it's like, see, he knows.

[00:09:10] He knows what he's doing.

[00:09:12] Oh, yeah.

[00:09:13] He's just a simple country captain of a, you know, flagship of Starfleet.

[00:09:17] Well, and to that point, John, Sustis 3 is a Gorn planet.

[00:09:22] So saying up to your ass in alligators is kind of a racial slur.

[00:09:26] And I don't appreciate that, Captain Pike.

[00:09:29] I do love all of the drama we see when Georgiou comes off throughout this episode.

[00:09:34] It is jarring to return to this relationship between Michael and Georgiou coming from the

[00:09:40] end of the series.

[00:09:40] I was like, oh, I forgot how antagonistic they were in this season.

[00:09:45] So that was exciting.

[00:09:47] And yeah, just all the looks, Pike knowing something's going on, but not what's going on.

[00:09:50] And Michael, all the history between them.

[00:09:53] There's a lot of really good drama built into there.

[00:09:57] Yeah.

[00:09:57] Great face acting from all of them.

[00:09:59] Oh, yeah.

[00:09:59] Yeah.

[00:10:00] A hundred percent.

[00:10:01] And is there any time in cinema when eating an apple doesn't make a character look cooler?

[00:10:07] Only the most Cavalier Starfleet captains eat apples on duty because that's right.

[00:10:13] This is right out of the Chris Pine Captain Kirk handbook, right?

[00:10:16] Yes, it is.

[00:10:17] That's right.

[00:10:17] Which kind of makes me wonder, is this a Kurtzman thing?

[00:10:21] Like, he was involved in both projects.

[00:10:23] Is this like his shorthand for like, this character doesn't care.

[00:10:27] They got better stuff to do.

[00:10:29] Look at them.

[00:10:29] They're eating an apple.

[00:10:30] Like, that might not be the exact math, but it seems like it's possibly almost a signature

[00:10:35] for him.

[00:10:37] Is there a forbidden knowledge thing going on there, do we think?

[00:10:40] I mean, she would be just devouring that forbidden apple if that's what it is.

[00:10:45] Or is she supposed to be the serpent or is section 31 the serpent?

[00:10:48] She does hiss later.

[00:10:50] Yeah.

[00:10:50] Yes, you're right.

[00:10:51] She's both.

[00:10:52] I'm just kind of bummed we didn't get to hear her say yum yum.

[00:10:55] And that would be where Naan gets it later.

[00:10:59] I think that would be fun, but I can't wait till we get to that episode.

[00:11:03] I thought you were making a there will be blood reference.

[00:11:05] I thought, okay.

[00:11:07] I'm not that advanced, John.

[00:11:09] There are no milkshakes in Star Trek.

[00:11:11] I don't know.

[00:11:12] That's the most famous yum yum in my mind.

[00:11:14] So, yeah.

[00:11:14] Okay.

[00:11:15] I don't know how much you guys are looking forward to the section 31 movie in January,

[00:11:20] but this episode kind of is a nice reintroduction to the players and the place in the disco

[00:11:29] universe, at least.

[00:11:30] How it kind of intersects is interesting at this point in time.

[00:11:35] That's true.

[00:11:36] I didn't thought of that, but that is a nice perk of rewatching this season right now.

[00:11:40] Yeah.

[00:11:41] That's a good point, especially considering what happens with section 31 throughout this

[00:11:46] season.

[00:11:47] Like I'm guessing the movie is going to be building off of the utter decimation they get.

[00:11:53] Like they get pretty well destroyed almost entirely by the end of this season, don't

[00:11:58] they?

[00:11:58] So, yeah.

[00:11:59] They do.

[00:12:00] This is good to be watching this.

[00:12:02] You know, one of the reasons I'm the most excited for the section 31 movie is because

[00:12:08] there will not be any Ash Tyler in it.

[00:12:10] Let me be the first to say, oh, Ash Tyler.

[00:12:15] Why can't they just comb his damn beard?

[00:12:18] Like put some oil in it.

[00:12:19] I get it.

[00:12:20] Okay.

[00:12:21] They don't follow protocol.

[00:12:22] I just like, I don't even care if they comb his hair, but the beard drives me bananas as

[00:12:27] a bearded person.

[00:12:28] I'm like, dude, that would be so itchy all the time.

[00:12:31] It is distracting to me.

[00:12:33] And no, I'm not.

[00:12:34] I'm just not a fan of Ash Tyler.

[00:12:36] And as Cameron pointed out last week, they play every angle with him.

[00:12:40] I don't understand why he hates him so much this episode.

[00:12:43] Why who?

[00:12:44] Pike?

[00:12:45] Pike.

[00:12:45] Yeah.

[00:12:46] Probably because Pike knows what happened to the previous doctor on this ship.

[00:12:51] And he's kind of like enmeshed himself as the stepdad, right?

[00:12:56] Who really cares.

[00:12:57] The dad that stepped up, not like Captain Lorca.

[00:13:00] And my guess would be that he is at least thinking of Ash Tyler as a danger, right?

[00:13:07] Because he's like, there are people here that remember what you did.

[00:13:10] That's going to make it difficult for me to get my job done.

[00:13:12] And I want my crew to feel warm and fuzzy as often as possible.

[00:13:17] But that's my point is there are people there who remember what he's done.

[00:13:21] There are people there who knew Ash Tyler and would find it hard to separate Voke from Ash

[00:13:26] Tyler.

[00:13:26] Meanwhile, Pike just read about it in a report.

[00:13:29] So he can easily go, oh, I see.

[00:13:30] He was mind controlled for shorthand.

[00:13:33] It wasn't him.

[00:13:35] But he seems more personally offended by Ash being on there than anyone else on the ship

[00:13:39] who has every right to be.

[00:13:41] Well, it's also a section 31 thing.

[00:13:43] Pike is just diametrically opposed to the idea.

[00:13:46] But he's grumpier with Ash Tyler than he is with Georgiou or his buddy.

[00:13:52] Yeah, Ash Tyler didn't flirt with him.

[00:13:54] Like.

[00:13:56] Okay, fair.

[00:13:57] I mean, think about it.

[00:13:57] And to your other point, Cameron, everybody else is busy this episode.

[00:14:00] Okay.

[00:14:01] They don't have time for a scene where people recognize Ash Tyler.

[00:14:05] Yeah.

[00:14:05] Like everybody has to really, really plainly state some, you know, basic theory of what

[00:14:10] Starfleet is about.

[00:14:11] There is one good shot of Stamets reacting to Tyler.

[00:14:14] But yeah.

[00:14:15] Seriously.

[00:14:17] Yeah.

[00:14:17] Like Anthony Rapp.

[00:14:18] Like, I think I said it in season five.

[00:14:20] Like the dude can frigging act.

[00:14:23] And like he really does haunted in a way that almost no other character on this show does,

[00:14:29] which is really saying something because everybody on this show is very haunted all the time.

[00:14:34] So for him to stand out even amongst that is incredibly impressive.

[00:14:39] And I do.

[00:14:39] He's amazing.

[00:14:40] I love that scene.

[00:14:42] It's there's like a little bit of a, are you serious right now?

[00:14:46] On his face when he recognizes what's going on.

[00:14:48] And like, uh, I, but you know, I, I will give this series it's, you know, maybe well-earned

[00:14:55] jabs and japes, but I do love this season.

[00:14:58] It still might be my favorite season.

[00:14:59] I'm going to reassess that at the end.

[00:15:02] But one of the things I love about this episode in particular is angry Tilly.

[00:15:07] We don't get angry Tilly very frequently, but, and I fully get it.

[00:15:12] Okay.

[00:15:13] But I don't need the camera shake in the scene where she's yelling at may like,

[00:15:18] just put the camera on a damn tripod and leave it there.

[00:15:23] I don't need that.

[00:15:25] Like, again, I understand it, but I personally am not a huge fan of that in that particular

[00:15:30] sequence.

[00:15:33] It is a really good scene.

[00:15:34] I love the Tilly May scene.

[00:15:35] Uh, and I hadn't really thought about, but I think you're right.

[00:15:38] Cause it's a side of Tilly.

[00:15:39] We don't get to see very often.

[00:15:40] I also love how it's setting up like, and we don't really get the, the promise of the

[00:15:45] premise of it, but they're setting it up like this classic, uh, Joseph

[00:15:48] Campbell's story here.

[00:15:50] Like she's got to go slay a beast.

[00:15:52] She's a reluctant hero.

[00:15:53] She resists the call at first, but eventually she takes it on and has a supernatural guide

[00:15:58] and as a changed person, when she returns home, don't look up the rest of the, just

[00:16:02] fit in with the episode.

[00:16:04] But those ones though, at least I was setting up like this classic kind of fairy tale

[00:16:08] of her having to go slay the monster.

[00:16:10] And I thought that was a lot of fun.

[00:16:11] Now she's really on theme for the goo rave too.

[00:16:14] Cause she's slimy throughout the entire episode.

[00:16:17] Her hair is just covered in slime and it's kind of a good look.

[00:16:21] She's had a rough couple of shooting weeks.

[00:16:24] Like between this, getting knocked on her ass, having that Ghostbuster trap pointed at her

[00:16:29] face.

[00:16:29] Like she's had some serious hair and makeup going on this season.

[00:16:34] And it, again,

[00:16:36] but it is nice to go back.

[00:16:37] I mean, having just watched the last season, kind of going back to early Tilly and seeing

[00:16:41] how you guys have probably mentioned this at some earlier point in the season already,

[00:16:46] but just seeing how fully realized that like character arc has been for her over the course

[00:16:51] of the show is, was great.

[00:16:53] Cause it's a different Tilly in season two than we got towards the end of the season.

[00:16:57] So there really was development for that character in a great way.

[00:17:00] Yeah.

[00:17:00] Like the anger we get to see from her, like we wouldn't see that in season five because

[00:17:05] she, she has been there and it's like, okay, that's not how you react to almost any situation

[00:17:10] whatsoever.

[00:17:11] And I do like that as soon as may is like, no, no, no, it's hurting us.

[00:17:15] I need your help.

[00:17:16] Tilly's like, oh, okay.

[00:17:17] What can I do?

[00:17:19] Well, she's like, yeah, that's right.

[00:17:22] That's what I'm here for.

[00:17:24] All right.

[00:17:24] Kill this monster.

[00:17:26] My moral indignation at being kidnapped or yes, though, the moral, uh, uh, honorable

[00:17:32] thing to do to help you when, when we've caused the problem.

[00:17:34] Do we, am I forgetting a plot point from a previous episode?

[00:17:38] Do we know why they're dying?

[00:17:40] It's because it's not because of you, right?

[00:17:42] That's a separate issue.

[00:17:43] Okay.

[00:17:43] So it, it's actually explained in this episode, but it's like maybe two lines.

[00:17:48] The hell you say.

[00:17:50] There's a tree in the mycelial network that is poisonous and Stamets has been covering

[00:17:59] himself in the bark.

[00:18:00] Sorry.

[00:18:01] Colber has been covering himself in the bark of this tree as a defense.

[00:18:04] So when they try to turn him into mycelia or something, uh, it kills them.

[00:18:13] So they take that as him trying to harm them rather than trying to defend himself.

[00:18:19] But, but they say their entire culture, their entire world is in danger.

[00:18:24] That doesn't seem, that just seems like one small monster that they can't touch.

[00:18:27] Cause he's running around.

[00:18:28] I, I, isn't there something like the discovery can no longer go into the spore network because

[00:18:32] of this?

[00:18:33] Yeah.

[00:18:33] She did mention previously that every time they go there, it's dangerous.

[00:18:38] Yeah.

[00:18:38] And my guess is it's kind of a similar reason, right?

[00:18:40] Like you're putting matter into our universe.

[00:18:42] It's not supposed to be in here, but I mean, to your point, Cameron, they seem to be able

[00:18:47] to just eat the whole of the discovery.

[00:18:49] So I don't know.

[00:18:51] Maybe it's the actual passage.

[00:18:52] Maybe it's a warp speed limit style problem.

[00:18:55] That's, that's kind of the feeling.

[00:18:56] Exactly what it feels like.

[00:18:59] Yeah.

[00:19:00] Okay.

[00:19:00] Yeah.

[00:19:01] I just, I wasn't sure if I was forgetting something or missing something,

[00:19:03] but yeah.

[00:19:04] Speaking of forgetting things, I was pretty sure the monster was one of those tardigrades

[00:19:08] and I was like, oh, they're going to have to fight a tardigrade.

[00:19:13] Right.

[00:19:13] Do I remember this correctly?

[00:19:15] I do not.

[00:19:15] Spoiler alert.

[00:19:18] Caveman Culber.

[00:19:19] Yeah.

[00:19:21] That's right.

[00:19:21] I mean, even Altura, he, he kind of looks like Prince.

[00:19:26] Like if he, if he and Ash Tyler had a scraggle off, I still think.

[00:19:33] Oh, man.

[00:19:34] That Culber would win because even messed up, he looks great.

[00:19:37] And now thankfully the, uh, you know, mycelial transporter pod, which I can't believe they

[00:19:43] didn't say.

[00:19:44] They said transporter pad and the pod was right there.

[00:19:46] Anyways.

[00:19:47] Yeah.

[00:19:47] Yeah.

[00:19:48] What's nice about that is it comes with a most recently approved selfie haircut service so

[00:19:53] that when you go between universes, you come out looking all clean cut.

[00:19:56] That was a pretty cool feature of that little transporter pod.

[00:20:00] Yeah.

[00:20:00] Handy.

[00:20:01] I did.

[00:20:02] I did like the organic transporter a lot.

[00:20:04] I thought that was a fun bit of techno babble.

[00:20:07] Uh, that was the one bit of techno babble I enjoyed in this episode.

[00:20:12] Cause wow.

[00:20:13] The rest of it who for being a scientist, Stamets sure is comfortable playing in the certainty

[00:20:19] sandbox.

[00:20:20] He is just so confident about it.

[00:20:23] You are preaching about an untested theory on the science that you're just beginning to

[00:20:29] scratch the surface of, but you can tell us exactly down to the minute how long we have

[00:20:32] in there.

[00:20:33] Right.

[00:20:33] And he like, at least that's consistent with him as a character.

[00:20:38] Right.

[00:20:38] Yes.

[00:20:39] Yes.

[00:20:39] Did I see this right?

[00:20:41] Where he says the reason Culber is there and why like, they're not pulling Tasha ER out

[00:20:46] or anything from the Mycelia network is because he was holding Culber like at the second he

[00:20:52] died and like kissed his tear.

[00:20:55] So I'm like, is this a doing part two thing we got going on?

[00:20:58] Like what is happening?

[00:21:00] Okay.

[00:21:01] Yes.

[00:21:03] And it's because.

[00:21:04] I shed a tear at the death of any reason during that sequence.

[00:21:09] It's because he was like, uh, back and forth between universes at that moment.

[00:21:16] So I think it's not necessarily just that it was, you know, the magic of love or some

[00:21:20] crap like that.

[00:21:22] Am I right guys?

[00:21:24] But it's because he already had some kind of like inter, inter universal thing going

[00:21:30] on.

[00:21:31] Cause he wasn't really fully present there.

[00:21:34] He kept going back and forth.

[00:21:35] So there was that scene where you see him like become completely cogent and his eyes are

[00:21:42] not glazed over.

[00:21:43] And then he was like, Oh, Hey, you're back.

[00:21:46] And then he's like, ah, just kidding.

[00:21:47] And then he goes back to like the white eyes stuck in the Mycelial.

[00:21:51] It's a little, it's, I don't know.

[00:21:53] It's a little sleeping beauty, but I'm, I'm okay with it.

[00:21:56] I really feel like this entire little plot point here is somebody in the writer's room

[00:22:02] going, look, we probably should not have killed Culber.

[00:22:06] Like that was a bad choice.

[00:22:08] Can we change that?

[00:22:13] Sure.

[00:22:13] Yeah.

[00:22:14] Um, yeah, I will talk about like the science, you know, we just watched Genesis, uh, from

[00:22:19] TNG over on green shirt.

[00:22:20] And I thought that was a pretty good comparison to this episode because both episodes use real

[00:22:25] science and just insane ways.

[00:22:28] This one kind of throws around the, you know, the conservation of mass, because for some

[00:22:32] reason that proves that, that till he's alive, I did not follow that at all either.

[00:22:37] And Genesis, of course, talked about prenatal immunity and used to insane ways in Genesis.

[00:22:43] But I think the difference why I actually had a pretty great time with Genesis and why I

[00:22:48] had struggled a little bit with this one is Genesis just doesn't take itself seriously.

[00:22:52] It uses that science.

[00:22:53] This is a very Trekkie thing, right?

[00:22:55] Like just, let's just throw out some crazy science and have a fun little romp.

[00:22:58] We're going to have Riker turn into a caveman and eat Livingston.

[00:23:01] Okay.

[00:23:01] I'm on board with the tone of this episode.

[00:23:03] I don't need to follow the science that much, but this episode is like asking half of

[00:23:08] my brain to just go along with the craziest of ideas.

[00:23:12] And then the other half of my brain to just buy into the realistic emotional trauma of

[00:23:17] these characters.

[00:23:18] And I feel a lot like the Discovery trapped in kind of two incompatible worlds trying

[00:23:23] to make sense of it all.

[00:23:24] Well, and to back you up, which, you know, I don't like to do, but you'd love to back

[00:23:30] me up.

[00:23:30] They kind of contradict themselves even because Stamets is like, yeah, here's how this

[00:23:36] universal law works and it'll totally be fine.

[00:23:39] And then when they try to come back, we have like the disappearing man hand moment and he

[00:23:46] goes, oh, well, matter works like this.

[00:23:48] And May goes, yeah, in your universe.

[00:23:50] And it's like, yeah, so maybe there's a whole other set of physics in this mycelial universe,

[00:23:55] but we're not going to worry about that.

[00:23:58] I call that my warp field of dreams scene.

[00:24:00] So, oh, nice.

[00:24:02] Nice.

[00:24:03] Nice.

[00:24:05] But to me, it is so clear that they were like, get Culber back.

[00:24:10] I don't care how you do it.

[00:24:11] I don't care if it makes sense.

[00:24:13] Bring Culber back.

[00:24:14] And you know what?

[00:24:15] I'm here for that decision.

[00:24:16] I completely support it.

[00:24:17] I also don't care how it happens.

[00:24:19] Yeah.

[00:24:20] Especially with the way they completely paid it off in season five and didn't leave

[00:24:24] his storyline hanging at all.

[00:24:29] But jumping forward a little bit, I do appreciate that.

[00:24:32] Like there is a cost to it, right?

[00:24:33] Like they don't just bring him back and it's like, hey, Culber's back.

[00:24:36] All right.

[00:24:36] Moving on.

[00:24:37] Like they're they work for it in the next few episodes.

[00:24:41] They do.

[00:24:41] And yeah.

[00:24:41] And as John alluded to, they never fully bring him back to the way he was.

[00:24:45] So until he works, Tilly definitely has that scene where you see that she feels the

[00:24:49] loss of May.

[00:24:50] Right.

[00:24:51] Like even though May wasn't air quotes real and may have been a little invasive in her

[00:24:57] communication procedures, Tilly still misses her presence, you know?

[00:25:01] And I think that for me, that fits well with like any of the DS9 symbiont Trill stuff.

[00:25:08] Right.

[00:25:08] Like it works because I'll be honest when she said how many beings have existed within each

[00:25:14] other.

[00:25:15] I was like, well, like a lot.

[00:25:16] That's like Trill's whole thing.

[00:25:20] That's not a big deal for Star Trek viewers.

[00:25:22] But I do also get the sense, as I think I may have mentioned before, that they were kind

[00:25:26] of banking on this being the first Star Trek series that a lot of people saw.

[00:25:30] Right.

[00:25:30] Because it was the first wave on TV for a long time.

[00:25:34] There were younger fans that were going to get into this.

[00:25:36] And we know that the fan base for this show is very cross-sectional and diverse.

[00:25:42] So I could easily see them going like, look, we got to kind of set some baselines here for

[00:25:48] folks that haven't seen Star Trek.

[00:25:49] But you know who has seen Star Trek?

[00:25:53] Our callers.

[00:25:54] All right.

[00:25:55] Let's go ahead.

[00:25:56] First time caller to open Pike Night.

[00:25:58] Here is Katie.

[00:26:00] Hi, I'm Katie.

[00:26:01] Katie.

[00:26:02] So I took a minute to rewatch this episode because, well, I was joking when I said that

[00:26:08] the only thing that I remembered from this episode was Kat showing up at the end.

[00:26:13] Holy cow brains, Batman.

[00:26:15] I was not joking.

[00:26:16] I did not remember any of the crazy number of things that were happening at all.

[00:26:22] So yeah.

[00:26:25] It was fun, though.

[00:26:26] It was actually a lot of fun to rewatch this one.

[00:26:27] You know, all those little bits of like, oh, poor Tilly and like Michael and Stamets together

[00:26:33] is great.

[00:26:34] I forget how much I enjoy that like pair of them just being buddies and being together.

[00:26:42] Then just everything with Georgiou, everything with Georgiou.

[00:26:45] She's just, yeah, she rocks.

[00:26:47] And I really enjoyed Michael running through the ship at the beginning.

[00:26:51] Like I do understand why they don't run through the ship.

[00:26:54] Or at least I understand why I think they don't run through the ship.

[00:26:58] But it was also really nice to see.

[00:27:00] So I definitely appreciated that.

[00:27:02] And yeah, this was way more fun and engaging to watch when I knew that I had people to

[00:27:07] talk to about it.

[00:27:08] So thanks for that.

[00:27:09] Bye.

[00:27:10] That might be the best reason to call into Open Pike Night.

[00:27:13] We know as Star Trek fans, you don't always have somebody standing right there who wants

[00:27:18] to talk about Star Trek a lot, like every day with you as soon as you're done watching.

[00:27:23] So thank you so much, Katie.

[00:27:25] And I have to agree on Admiral Kat.

[00:27:28] Like, yes, she shows up to basically say out loud, look, Tachyons can be whatever we

[00:27:33] want them to be.

[00:27:34] Okay.

[00:27:34] That's why we love them.

[00:27:37] But I still love her screen presence.

[00:27:40] I love what this season actually ends up doing with her.

[00:27:45] I think she really represents the best in the good Star Trek admirals, right?

[00:27:50] Because we're so used to the bad morals.

[00:27:52] And we got Leland, who's like the king of arch acting this entire season.

[00:27:57] And we'll get into that later.

[00:27:59] But like Kat is a very calming, resetting presence.

[00:28:03] And yeah, I think as we were speaking in the Discord, it was like she kind of offers some

[00:28:08] realism to Starfleet.

[00:28:10] Like, yeah, this is an organization.

[00:28:12] It has rules.

[00:28:13] There are people who are your boss.

[00:28:20] Thank you for jumping on board, Katie.

[00:28:22] That's a heck of a good first call, if I must say so myself.

[00:28:25] Yeah.

[00:28:26] Agreed.

[00:28:27] Yeah.

[00:28:27] Kat is, she is the AD Skinner of Star Trek.

[00:28:31] Like, she is the, all right, I know you just went through this weird thing, but hang on.

[00:28:36] There's Tachyons.

[00:28:37] Here's the real stuff going on.

[00:28:39] And, you know, probably got some coverups going of her own.

[00:28:41] But she is, she was a good choice for the character.

[00:28:46] And it's, I think they use her well every time they use her, every time they bring her on.

[00:28:51] I had completely forgotten about her.

[00:28:54] So I, for that reason alone, reminding me of this great character is making this rewatch

[00:28:59] all worthwhile.

[00:29:00] She doesn't die at the end of the season, does she?

[00:29:03] Because it would be great to see her in Strange New Worlds.

[00:29:05] Spoiler alert.

[00:29:05] I love this character.

[00:29:06] She totally dies at the end of the season.

[00:29:08] Super dies.

[00:29:08] Okay.

[00:29:09] Super dies even.

[00:29:11] All right.

[00:29:11] Yeah.

[00:29:11] Like, possibly the most dead anyone has ever been in Star Trek.

[00:29:15] Like, they can't pull her out of a mushroom.

[00:29:17] I mean, in Strange New Worlds.

[00:29:19] Let me just throw it out there that I don't think she's coming back.

[00:29:22] I don't think so.

[00:29:23] Yeah.

[00:29:25] You think she's Patel's mom?

[00:29:26] They kind of look alike.

[00:29:27] Maybe an aunt.

[00:29:28] I always, like, the first time I saw Patel, I got, I was like, hmm, I wonder if they're

[00:29:32] trying to sort of have her be, like, of the same type, just for viewers of Discovery

[00:29:39] to feel that kind of presence.

[00:29:41] But I don't know.

[00:29:42] Well, to your point, Cameron, I think some folks thought Patel was Admiral Kat the first

[00:29:48] time they saw her.

[00:29:49] Because you're right that there is a similar energy going on there of like, hey, look,

[00:29:54] I love rules.

[00:29:56] And I will follow those rules.

[00:29:58] But I'm also cool.

[00:29:59] Like, you know, I'm cool.

[00:30:01] It's just this rules.

[00:30:02] And it's cool to follow the rules.

[00:30:05] Speaking of following the rules, it wasn't until watching, rewatching this episode that

[00:30:09] I was like, oh, yeah.

[00:30:11] Now I remember how they deal with the hologram communicators and why those aren't a thing

[00:30:16] later on.

[00:30:17] Like, okay.

[00:30:17] Okay.

[00:30:18] That's right.

[00:30:18] They did find a way to sort of shoehorn Discovery back in line with everything.

[00:30:23] Yeah.

[00:30:24] Right.

[00:30:25] And let's be honest, like Section 31 is absolutely inflating their budget for organizational reasons.

[00:30:32] Right?

[00:30:32] Like, oh, no, we have to have holographic communicators.

[00:30:36] No, we have to have a tractor beam that has like physical pieces on the end of torpedoes

[00:30:42] to it for like really good reasons.

[00:30:44] And like, I'll say it.

[00:30:45] It looks cool.

[00:30:46] But it is less efficient.

[00:30:49] It doesn't work.

[00:30:50] Yeah.

[00:30:50] It's like, all right, it's on.

[00:30:52] Okay.

[00:30:52] You have one minute before this whole thing blows up my ship.

[00:30:55] Sorry, dude.

[00:30:55] Like, then why do you have that?

[00:30:57] Why not just a regular tractor beam?

[00:31:00] But I do like the hollow cloaking and like how betrayed Pike feels like.

[00:31:07] I can't believe you would pretend to be an asteroid.

[00:31:10] You bastard.

[00:31:12] Yeah.

[00:31:12] That one I was like, I'm not.

[00:31:14] What?

[00:31:14] Did you?

[00:31:15] Had we seen the asteroid?

[00:31:17] Was that the subspace asteroid that they were going on?

[00:31:19] I don't know.

[00:31:20] Yeah.

[00:31:21] That moment felt a little weird that he was all pissed off about that.

[00:31:24] I did.

[00:31:25] Between that and really Clem Fandango just getting the chance to look anguished this entire episode.

[00:31:31] Like, that's all he got was just like, oh, man.

[00:31:35] Oh, man.

[00:31:36] That's his entire facial reaction this entire episode.

[00:31:40] And I am here for it.

[00:31:41] I know you don't like Ash, Tyler, Jesse, but I don't know.

[00:31:45] I think I got a special place in my heart for him.

[00:31:47] Yeah.

[00:31:48] You do soften it when you say Clem Fandango.

[00:31:50] Can you hear me?

[00:31:51] This is Clem Fandango.

[00:31:52] Can you hear me?

[00:31:53] It's all part of the service.

[00:31:55] Yes.

[00:31:56] Yeah.

[00:31:57] I just, I don't know.

[00:31:59] I don't think it's the actor.

[00:32:00] I really don't.

[00:32:01] And I don't want this to come across as me saying, I don't like Shahzad Latif because that's not what it is.

[00:32:06] Just the character bugs me in so many ways.

[00:32:10] And like Cam had mentioned before, they play every angle with it.

[00:32:13] He's like, I am Vogue.

[00:32:14] And then Michael's like, no, he's not Vogue.

[00:32:17] And sometimes Ash, Tyler's like, I'm not Vogue.

[00:32:19] And it's like, okay, dude, like pick a lane.

[00:32:27] Although he did say vocabulary at one point.

[00:32:29] I was like, ah, vocabulary.

[00:32:30] Got it.

[00:32:32] Anyway, here's another caller.

[00:32:33] Let's listen to Abby.

[00:32:34] I can't believe I missed that.

[00:32:37] Hey, hey, Open Pike.

[00:32:38] It's Abby Summer from the First Flight Podcast calling in about the saints of imperfection.

[00:32:42] And I know you guys are going to cover all the big stuff and the both heart tugging yet hand waving of mycelial resurrection

[00:32:50] and all the wonderfulness that we have in all those plots.

[00:32:54] So I'm going to pull two things that just make me smile.

[00:32:56] Every single time I watch this episode.

[00:32:59] One, I absolutely love Cornwell calling Pike and Leland on their manlier than thou bullshit.

[00:33:06] Classic line.

[00:33:07] I love her character more and more every single time I watch all of Discovery.

[00:33:11] She's a hidden gem in the first two seasons.

[00:33:14] And the second thing I wanted to point out, because it wouldn't be me if I didn't notice costumes,

[00:33:18] but I want Giorgio's earrings, ear cuffs.

[00:33:22] I'm not sure exactly what they are, but the little squiggly ones, they are amazing.

[00:33:26] They are gorgeous.

[00:33:28] The first time I saw them, my jaw hung open.

[00:33:30] I love the jewelry on Discovery and especially on Giorgio.

[00:33:34] She gets incredibly gorgeous pieces.

[00:33:36] So just wanted to throw that out there.

[00:33:38] Hope this finds you well.

[00:33:39] It wouldn't be an Abby call without costumes.

[00:33:41] And yeah, and I had noticed she sent us a couple of pictures, Abby.

[00:33:44] In the email, she sent us a picture of Giorgio's ear cuff things and she sent a picture of Cornwell.

[00:33:49] And I forgot the epaulets on Cornwell's uniform there.

[00:33:53] I think that makes, I think that's my favorite version of the Discovery uniforms.

[00:33:59] Like having the extra gold kind of completes them for me.

[00:34:03] Otherwise they just feel too jumpsuity.

[00:34:05] Did you guys notice Giorgio at one point in the episode used all of her dignitary names?

[00:34:14] From the mirror universe.

[00:34:16] And it reminded me with all the jewelry and, you know, all the pomp of her arrival on board.

[00:34:21] It reminded me of Loxana Troy and how she always says all of the honorifics of her name.

[00:34:26] Oh, you know that Giorgio's held the Chalice of Rix a time or two.

[00:34:32] Yeah.

[00:34:32] Yeah.

[00:34:32] That line was an example.

[00:34:35] If I noticed this episode particularly has a lot of just pretty clunky exposition.

[00:34:40] You know, Commander Pike, Spock did not know you were commanding the ship when he left.

[00:34:44] Or like, yeah, does he know who you really are?

[00:34:46] Oh, you mean Giorgio, emperor of the Terran Empire?

[00:34:50] And like, I know you have to do it for audiences and everything, but there was a lot of it in this episode, I noticed.

[00:34:55] There is.

[00:34:56] And that actually runs throughout the season, which I don't know if that's a function of the way Discovery is structured, but it is a thing that you notice.

[00:35:05] And then some of us are just fine with Cameron.

[00:35:07] Jeez.

[00:35:09] I remember once we get to the Kelpien episode, the storyline, like, man, I remember there being so much of that going on.

[00:35:17] That is a straight up documentary as far as the exposition is concerned, which, yeah.

[00:35:23] Well, I mean, we love Kristen Byer on here.

[00:35:26] She's been on the show.

[00:35:27] She's great.

[00:35:28] I did know she wrote this episode.

[00:35:30] And I know that Discovery season two was like one of her first forays into screenwriting and teleplay writing from books.

[00:35:36] And I was wondering if that was part of it, because in a book, you can totally write that.

[00:35:39] You can be like, oh, yeah, she was Emperor Giorgio of blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:35:42] And it works fine.

[00:35:43] But when you put it into a character's mouth, it comes out as like, okay.

[00:35:47] Two things.

[00:35:47] Thank you for the reminder.

[00:35:48] Two things here, Cameron.

[00:35:49] Thing one, I am so excited for you to finally watch season one of Picard in what, like a year or six months, whatever it is.

[00:35:58] Like six months.

[00:35:59] Pretty soon.

[00:36:00] Yeah, six months.

[00:36:01] But that was written by a novelist.

[00:36:03] And it is so incredibly apparent throughout the entire season that it was written by a novelist, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but you will notice that same thing.

[00:36:14] And second of all, to address Abby's point specifically, I like to think that Giorgio pulled that earring off of like a Klingon adversary that she totally conquered while she was still in the Terran universe.

[00:36:28] She was like, oh, I like that.

[00:36:30] That's kind of badass.

[00:36:30] I'm going to put that on my ear after I tear it out of yours.

[00:36:35] Or she was in the universe where the Bajorans were bad guys and parallels, you know, pulled off the Bajoran.

[00:36:41] But there was no dangly.

[00:36:43] Yeah.

[00:36:43] Can't pull off every piece of jewelry.

[00:36:45] Do we?

[00:36:45] Yeah.

[00:36:48] Going back to plot points, I'm not sure if I missed.

[00:36:52] Do we ever find out why she was in Spock's shuttle?

[00:36:54] Oh, she caught up to it first and she went on there to arrest him and he wasn't there.

[00:37:02] So it was just flying on auto with no one in it?

[00:37:05] Is that difficult for you to believe?

[00:37:08] But why?

[00:37:09] Because he's trying to hide his trail.

[00:37:13] Okay.

[00:37:14] All right.

[00:37:15] And she caught up to it first.

[00:37:16] I was like, are you taking issue with autopilot on a 23rd century shuttle?

[00:37:20] Sure.

[00:37:21] They just never said that's what happened.

[00:37:23] Yeah.

[00:37:24] They did a whole cheat.

[00:37:25] So why were you doing evasion procedures with us then?

[00:37:29] Like, they hand wave it away.

[00:37:31] It's just one of those don't ask too many questions.

[00:37:34] They explain that because her instinct is to run when authority shows up.

[00:37:39] She says innocent people don't run.

[00:37:40] And Georgiou goes, exactly.

[00:37:42] That's why I was running.

[00:37:43] Because I am not an innocent people.

[00:37:46] It's a quippy comeback.

[00:37:48] That's right.

[00:37:49] Yeah.

[00:37:49] I mean, Georgiou is like 45% quips.

[00:37:53] And 30% barbs.

[00:37:54] So, yeah.

[00:37:55] And 20% leather.

[00:37:57] Yep.

[00:37:59] Imagining the rather pretentious opening of words are identities and syllables are limbs.

[00:38:06] The letters are fingernails and toenails.

[00:38:09] But I just like when she goes through and names the words and just goes to Georgiou.

[00:38:12] It's like quippy.

[00:38:14] Yeah.

[00:38:14] Yeah.

[00:38:14] That would have been the word that's her identity.

[00:38:17] Like, you know, here's what they call a teaser in the business.

[00:38:20] When we get to the end of this, I'll talk about the closing narration, which I liked way

[00:38:24] more than the opening narration in this episode personally.

[00:38:27] Yeah.

[00:38:28] Yeah.

[00:38:28] The opening's there only to set up the end.

[00:38:30] Yeah.

[00:38:30] Well, and really quickly, speaking of quips, I know that Stamets is trying to reassure

[00:38:36] Culber when he says, I'll see you on the other side.

[00:38:40] But the way he points at him and says that, it kind of feels like a threat.

[00:38:44] Like, see you in hell.

[00:38:48] Coming after you.

[00:38:49] That take is so good.

[00:38:51] It just jumps off of the screen.

[00:38:53] And it might have been the inspiration for my song choice for later.

[00:38:57] Oh, nice.

[00:38:58] Very good.

[00:38:59] You're getting teasers all over this episode.

[00:39:03] All right.

[00:39:03] Well, let's go ahead and hear from our third caller.

[00:39:06] Here is Mr. Platy M3.

[00:39:09] Hey, OpenPikeNight.

[00:39:10] It's Platy M3 calling back with my hits, shits, and giggles.

[00:39:12] So, first off, hits.

[00:39:14] Love all the Pike stuff here.

[00:39:16] Pike and his horse references.

[00:39:17] Last episode, he's talking about, you know, don't spare with the horses.

[00:39:20] Go faster.

[00:39:21] This episode, he's asking Philippa what it's like to be back in the saddle.

[00:39:24] Good character moment there for him.

[00:39:26] Also, good character moment is the way they write Pike and show him.

[00:39:30] He was amazingly observant.

[00:39:32] He noticed Michael's little beat with the phaser pointed at Philippa.

[00:39:35] And he noticed her reaction to seeing Ash Tyler.

[00:39:38] And pretty cool that he trusts her that quickly, that fast.

[00:39:42] And that they shot this way on TV.

[00:39:44] He had all his little glances that he knows what's going on.

[00:39:47] Or at least something's going on.

[00:39:48] Shits, we got Leland.

[00:39:50] He's some bad shit dude.

[00:39:51] Obviously, because he's got no hair.

[00:39:52] Pike, big hair.

[00:39:53] He's a good guy.

[00:39:54] Ash Tyler, even bigger hair.

[00:39:56] Great guy.

[00:39:57] Another shit was when Tilly grabbed the Type 3 phaser rifle.

[00:40:01] It was just like in the middle of a hallway.

[00:40:02] His weapon storage just at corridor junctions.

[00:40:05] Even Michael went back later and it's like, there's like 10 weapons there total.

[00:40:09] And it's just in the floor in the middle of the hall.

[00:40:12] Whatever.

[00:40:13] Giggles, though.

[00:40:14] Oh, yeah.

[00:40:14] This was the episode with the huge ass.

[00:40:16] So got that out of the way.

[00:40:18] And love the lines that when they're inside the miscelial network and Tilly's trying to find everybody.

[00:40:25] May's like, oh, yeah.

[00:40:25] Maybe they all died trying to save you.

[00:40:27] And Tilly's like, oh, thanks for that.

[00:40:29] This is Platy M3 signing off.

[00:40:32] Okay.

[00:40:33] Is it possible that Tilly explaining why the rifle she's holding is called a Type 3 is the moment that Paramount realized, oh, we could make lower decks.

[00:40:44] We could do an animated comedy here.

[00:40:46] Like to have a character comment like, well, it's bigger than a regular phaser and that makes it cool is like absolute Boimler energy.

[00:40:54] And I'm nearly certain there's an exact Boimler line about that.

[00:40:57] Like, oh, phasers, big phasers.

[00:41:00] Like I was having so much fun.

[00:41:02] And Tilly is arguably like the joyous heart of this show.

[00:41:06] And I love that moment.

[00:41:09] And Platy, I'm glad to be picking up on some of the same things that you are because, man, you really know how to watch an episode of Star Trek, my friend.

[00:41:18] Who's big ass?

[00:41:19] No, huge ass.

[00:41:20] Huge ass.

[00:41:22] Huge ass.

[00:41:22] Huge ass.

[00:41:24] Yeah.

[00:41:24] When we asked.

[00:41:25] Yeah.

[00:41:26] The cocoon had some genetic material, but not enough for the body hair.

[00:41:30] No body hair coming out on Hugh.

[00:41:31] That's right.

[00:41:32] That's.

[00:41:34] Shaved completely.

[00:41:35] Glad that's what they chose to leave off on other appendages.

[00:41:39] Nothing dead will go.

[00:41:40] Well, Sam, we have some good news.

[00:41:41] Yeah.

[00:41:44] But he I do have to point out that in the discord, we asked for calls.

[00:41:50] And Platy replied, Hughes asked.

[00:41:54] I answered.

[00:41:55] And I was like, man, this guy could give us a run for our money.

[00:42:00] To his point, I do.

[00:42:02] I love all of Pike stuff.

[00:42:03] I feel like we're getting more Pike after a couple episodes.

[00:42:05] Not a lot.

[00:42:06] And yeah, I love how uncomfortable he is with black ops and everything.

[00:42:10] I do love the so far.

[00:42:13] I hate this plan line.

[00:42:14] That was great.

[00:42:15] I love him just completely forgoing the needs of the mini and saying, you know what?

[00:42:19] We're all going to risk our lives for one person.

[00:42:21] Yep.

[00:42:22] Let's do it.

[00:42:23] And then, yeah, I do love the moment going back to Abby with the manlier than thou bullshit

[00:42:28] at the end and just like the total non apologies they give each other.

[00:42:33] I have to walk a thin line.

[00:42:35] I cross that with you.

[00:42:36] I'm sorry.

[00:42:36] What does that mean?

[00:42:37] I walk a clearer path than you.

[00:42:39] That's the understatement of the century.

[00:42:40] What does that mean?

[00:42:41] What you guys just said are meaningless.

[00:42:43] That means nothing.

[00:42:44] You guys have not apologized.

[00:42:45] You're just like trying to save face in front of the Admiral.

[00:42:48] Leland has clearly done this before because he apologizes without actually saying, I'm sorry.

[00:42:54] He's just saying, I apologize.

[00:42:57] That's good enough.

[00:42:58] Right, mom?

[00:42:58] Okay.

[00:42:59] Thanks.

[00:42:59] Yeah.

[00:43:00] Like he, I, you guys, like I said, I have issues with a capital I with Leland.

[00:43:06] The entire season.

[00:43:07] But like, this is definitely where they start.

[00:43:10] Absolutely.

[00:43:11] But Cameron.

[00:43:13] Bad issues?

[00:43:13] I love Leland.

[00:43:14] I think he's a great kind of charming villain.

[00:43:17] I do not like him.

[00:43:18] And there are reasons for it.

[00:43:20] Like there are things that I think he's actually really good for as a character, but I don't

[00:43:26] know.

[00:43:26] It might be the performance mixed with kind of how the season ends where I was just like,

[00:43:32] we don't need this guy in a couple different ways, but like we'll, we'll get more into

[00:43:38] him because he does become more prevalent.

[00:43:40] But you mentioned that moment when Pike says, so far, I hate this plan.

[00:43:44] And we get this shot of Detmer and Owo, who I'm going to say it, this is the episode where

[00:43:50] you can tell they're falling in love, but they agree with that.

[00:43:53] They're like, oh yeah, like this plan kind of sucks.

[00:43:56] Like I'm not really sure about this, but it does give us one of my favorite discovery

[00:44:02] visuals ever, which is a ship at sea sinking in space.

[00:44:09] Like the half into the mycelial network visual is beautiful.

[00:44:13] It's intuitive.

[00:44:14] You immediately understand what's happening just by looking at it.

[00:44:18] And in the words of commander ransom, it's Duncan right in there like a giant cookie.

[00:44:23] And I was so happy to see this episode again.

[00:44:28] Yes, I, I, I have that.

[00:44:30] I, it's a great visual.

[00:44:31] I loved it, even though it doesn't make any sense.

[00:44:34] And, but it does serve as a great metaphor for my feelings on this episode.

[00:44:37] And, and it, it, it looks good.

[00:44:40] It's.

[00:44:40] And when the stamets finally comes and like reaches out to Culber and grabs the ax and

[00:44:44] breaks the handcuffs, you know, Culber tied to that pipe so they can start getting above,

[00:44:49] you know, it's just, it's a good romantic moment.

[00:44:52] So.

[00:44:52] Yeah.

[00:44:53] Yeah.

[00:44:53] And then that, that's right.

[00:44:54] That guy who's like maybe a butler or something pulls out that tiny gun and you're like, what

[00:44:59] are you going to go torture Captain Picard?

[00:45:01] Yeah.

[00:45:02] There it is.

[00:45:03] That's my most obscure series of, of callbacks ever.

[00:45:08] Anyone who gets them all, you can call in and mention what they're all from.

[00:45:13] Anyways, I do like, to your point, Cameron.

[00:45:16] Yeah.

[00:45:16] It's a little hand wavy with the science and everything.

[00:45:19] It is science fiction after all, but I like that we get a reason for the parts of the

[00:45:24] ship that Culber, sorry for the parts of the ship that Stamets and Michael are looking through

[00:45:31] to be completely empty, like a haunted house.

[00:45:34] Because Pike says like, okay, everybody get out of this part of the ship.

[00:45:37] It's going to get eaten.

[00:45:38] So it makes sense that it has this haunted house kind of feeling to it.

[00:45:41] And I like that that's at least consistent, you know, within its own setup.

[00:45:46] Because let's be real.

[00:45:48] There are some things in this season that are not consistent.

[00:45:50] There may be even some things in this episode, as we mentioned.

[00:45:53] Yeah.

[00:45:54] So, Wendy, I do have an important question.

[00:45:56] Have you ever broken a pinky promise to somebody?

[00:45:59] Because Tilly sure does at the end of this episode.

[00:46:03] Pinky swears were a big part of like elementary school for me.

[00:46:06] Boys didn't do that, right?

[00:46:08] Or did they?

[00:46:08] Did they secretly pinky swear?

[00:46:09] No.

[00:46:09] No, that's a girl thing.

[00:46:10] Yeah.

[00:46:11] We'd pretend to do like blood swears, but we're always too chicken shit to actually cut

[00:46:15] ourselves.

[00:46:16] I had friends that wanted to do like the spit handshake thing.

[00:46:19] And I'm like, no, I'm not doing that.

[00:46:21] I don't care about you that much.

[00:46:24] Yeah.

[00:46:25] You never break a pinky swear.

[00:46:26] Yeah.

[00:46:26] But unless, I mean, if it's a mushroom, you can.

[00:46:28] If you're pinky swearing a mushroom, it's kind of fine, I think.

[00:46:30] I mean, she's not even really real.

[00:46:32] But I do have a five-year-old daughter now, so I am coming to learn the importance of the

[00:46:37] pinky swear.

[00:46:38] So that's, you know, a bit of personal growth for me.

[00:46:42] So I'm working on it.

[00:46:43] That's big.

[00:46:47] What is my...

[00:46:48] My daughter tells me something terrible will happen to me if I

[00:46:51] break a pinky swear.

[00:46:52] What is it?

[00:46:53] It's like, you can promise, but if you break a pinky promise, that is extra bad.

[00:46:59] Oh.

[00:46:59] Now I kind of want to go watch the episode of Bluey where they keep making promises and

[00:47:03] then sometimes breaking them.

[00:47:05] Oh, yeah.

[00:47:06] Really, seriously, if you have kids, check out Bluey.

[00:47:08] And if you don't, check out Bluey.

[00:47:10] And for Star Trek Discovery, we're a Star Trek podcast, Jesse.

[00:47:13] That's what I meant.

[00:47:14] We're a column Star Trek podcast.

[00:47:15] Let's listen to a caller.

[00:47:16] Star Trek.

[00:47:17] Ha ha ha.

[00:47:19] Hi, guys.

[00:47:20] Here's your dedicated fan, Melanie.

[00:47:21] I was watching that episode a while back and can't seem to make much sense of my notes,

[00:47:26] so I watched it again.

[00:47:27] There is Spock's shuttle, but no Spock, as they will see.

[00:47:29] It's Georgiou.

[00:47:30] And did Pike shoot on the shuttle to make sure he did escape?

[00:47:33] Okay.

[00:47:34] It's five minutes in and what all happened here already?

[00:47:37] As Chief Anson Mount Love Officer, I will try to keep my focus on Anson.

[00:47:41] And there was one scene already when Michael comes to the bridge where he looks at her,

[00:47:46] checking how she is after the loss of Tilly.

[00:47:47] I liked it a lot.

[00:47:49] So, Georgiou drank Pike under the table at the academy.

[00:47:52] Fascinating.

[00:47:53] Then we have Leland's hologram versus Pike in the ready room.

[00:47:56] And I like the dialogue.

[00:47:57] Is that gray hair I see and Pike counters?

[00:48:00] It's one of the trade-offs of having actual hair.

[00:48:03] Love it.

[00:48:03] Give it to him and Chris.

[00:48:05] What is it with them?

[00:48:06] I would have liked to see them back at the academy.

[00:48:09] And Georgiou.

[00:48:09] She's not the way he remembers her to be.

[00:48:12] Of course, we know she's from the Mirror Universe.

[00:48:14] But Chris doesn't know that.

[00:48:16] And he asks Michael what secrets she's hiding.

[00:48:19] I like Pike's speech with

[00:48:20] Starfleet is a promise when they go after Tilly.

[00:48:22] It's great.

[00:48:23] It's him.

[00:48:24] He is living by what he says.

[00:48:25] I don't like the Section 31 ship.

[00:48:27] I prefer the Enterprise or Discovery very much more.

[00:48:31] So, Pike transported over there,

[00:48:33] got an apology from Leland,

[00:48:35] a dressing down from Admiral Cornwell,

[00:48:36] who tells both of them to behave.

[00:48:38] Love it.

[00:48:40] All right.

[00:48:40] So, I think it's a good episode.

[00:48:42] And what about Judas Priest's A Crown of Horns?

[00:48:44] A songwreck?

[00:48:45] I think that fits best from our playlist.

[00:48:47] Live long and prosper.

[00:48:49] Okay.

[00:48:49] Is that our first caller song pick?

[00:48:52] I think it might be.

[00:48:53] And Melanie introduced herself as the dedicated fan.

[00:48:57] And let me explain.

[00:48:58] That is absolutely the correct title.

[00:49:01] You described yourself as the Anson Mount love officer

[00:49:03] and has, in fact, requested a badge stating such.

[00:49:07] That is also the correct title.

[00:49:09] But Melanie just met Babs Alusenmokun in Germany at a convention.

[00:49:15] And she specifically told him,

[00:49:17] I would love to hear you on open Pike Night.

[00:49:19] It's a good environment.

[00:49:21] They're not going to ask difficult questions.

[00:49:23] Fans will call in.

[00:49:25] Like, she did this out of the goodness of her heart.

[00:49:28] She asked before she went like,

[00:49:30] hey, should I mention the show?

[00:49:31] And we're like,

[00:49:32] uh, sure.

[00:49:32] Yeah, that would be awesome.

[00:49:34] But please don't feel obligated.

[00:49:36] And then she explained,

[00:49:36] like, here's how it went.

[00:49:37] This is what I said.

[00:49:38] This is what he said.

[00:49:39] Like, thank you so much, Melanie,

[00:49:42] for not only your dedication to Anson Mount and Christopher Pike,

[00:49:45] but to open Pike Night.

[00:49:47] Fans like you and callers like you are really the best part of this show for us.

[00:49:51] Because, you know,

[00:49:52] sometimes Cameron struggles getting through an episode of Discovery.

[00:49:55] And I know that hearing the callers really helps put a salve on that wound.

[00:50:02] It's true.

[00:50:03] Melanie's the best.

[00:50:04] I really liked that Leland-Pike dynamic, too.

[00:50:07] And you could tell they had history, you know,

[00:50:08] when characters meet up for the first time on screen.

[00:50:10] But you can see that there's something between them.

[00:50:14] And it made me wonder, like, timeline-wise,

[00:50:17] I wonder if they could go back in Strange New Worlds

[00:50:20] and do a flashback of Pike and Leland dealing with the Gorn.

[00:50:25] Or something like that.

[00:50:26] That'd be fun to see Leland again, right?

[00:50:28] In Strange New Worlds.

[00:50:30] Just huge head of hair.

[00:50:31] Like, he has the Pike hairdo and Pike has the Crossroads hairdo.

[00:50:36] That's where he got it.

[00:50:37] I think they need to do that flashback.

[00:50:40] And if I'm not mistaken,

[00:50:42] the Section 31 movie is actually closer to their Academy days on the timeline, right?

[00:50:48] Because when Georgiou gets sent back,

[00:50:51] I think she goes back in time as well.

[00:50:54] So it's possible that there'll be a Leland character or something in the movie.

[00:50:59] I know nothing about this movie, and I love that.

[00:51:03] Like, the first trailer felt like an actual teaser trailer,

[00:51:06] where they're like, here's some cool stuff.

[00:51:08] You don't know what's going on.

[00:51:10] Get ready.

[00:51:11] Whereas most trailers these days are like,

[00:51:13] what if the whole plot was like this?

[00:51:15] And this is how the movie ends.

[00:51:17] And here's why that matters.

[00:51:19] And it's like, come on!

[00:51:21] Now I don't even want to watch the movie.

[00:51:22] And, you know, part of that is the movie's coming out now.

[00:51:25] But, like, that was...

[00:51:27] I'm really excited for Section 31 as a movie,

[00:51:30] which is impressive considering how much I dislike Leland,

[00:51:35] which, again, we will get to.

[00:51:38] Fair enough.

[00:51:39] Fair enough.

[00:51:39] Yeah.

[00:51:41] Well, we have one more caller.

[00:51:43] Our good friend Marcy decided to lend her voice here

[00:51:46] for The Saints of Imperfection.

[00:51:48] So here we go.

[00:51:48] Hey, Open Pike Knight.

[00:51:50] It's Marcy from Idle Ride Podcast.

[00:51:53] I didn't watch this episode again,

[00:51:55] but I did read the synopsis,

[00:51:57] and I was reminded,

[00:51:58] oh, yeah, this is the episode

[00:51:59] where everybody gets re-traumatized.

[00:52:03] And this also reminded me of why I love Captain Picard,

[00:52:07] because his number two was always Deanna,

[00:52:11] Deanna Troy, the counselor.

[00:52:13] And just think about how this would have gone

[00:52:15] a little bit differently.

[00:52:16] I mean, Deanna would have never let Tyler go to the bridge

[00:52:21] and have Stamets just see him,

[00:52:24] the person that murdered his partner,

[00:52:26] with no preparation.

[00:52:29] Deanna would have been there

[00:52:31] to help Stamets through the moment

[00:52:33] when he basically brings his lover back to life.

[00:52:36] She would have been there to help Hugh

[00:52:38] through his return to Discovery.

[00:52:43] So I always appreciated that about the next generation,

[00:52:47] that they actually had a counselor

[00:52:49] as a very prominent role,

[00:52:52] which they never really did again.

[00:52:53] I don't feel like in any of the other seasons,

[00:52:56] maybe somebody can prove me wrong.

[00:52:59] But yeah, Deanna, good job.

[00:53:02] Good job at being there

[00:53:04] and helping with the mental health of the crews

[00:53:06] that get traumatized over and over and over again,

[00:53:10] especially on Discovery.

[00:53:10] Man, whew.

[00:53:12] Anyway, hope you guys are having fun

[00:53:15] talking about this episode.

[00:53:17] Also, Michelle Yeo.

[00:53:18] I mean, she's back.

[00:53:20] We love it.

[00:53:21] Section 31.

[00:53:22] Amazing.

[00:53:23] Talk to you later.

[00:53:26] All right.

[00:53:27] Two things, Marcy.

[00:53:29] First of all, excellent point.

[00:53:31] And I think it's kind of telling that

[00:53:34] when you said this is the episode

[00:53:35] where everyone gets re-traumatized,

[00:53:37] I was like, that could be literally any episode

[00:53:39] of literally any season.

[00:53:41] Discovery.

[00:53:42] Yeah, Star Trek Discovery.

[00:53:43] But I'm okay with that.

[00:53:44] But I think it's a great point about Troy

[00:53:47] and the ship not having a counselor.

[00:53:49] And I think that's what makes it so good

[00:53:52] that Colbert decides,

[00:53:55] I'm going to be the counselor on this ship

[00:53:57] because it desperately needs one.

[00:53:59] And I am the person who has been through

[00:54:02] arguably the most emotional trauma

[00:54:04] of anyone on this crew,

[00:54:06] which again, I said arguable.

[00:54:08] You can pick somebody else if you like.

[00:54:10] But it makes a great arc for him

[00:54:12] because he does go through so much

[00:54:14] and there is nobody to help him.

[00:54:16] I mean, we know looking forward

[00:54:18] that he struggles just trying,

[00:54:20] you know, Stamets is like,

[00:54:21] hey, let's just fall back into our relationship,

[00:54:23] man.

[00:54:23] It's totally great.

[00:54:24] Like, I missed you.

[00:54:25] This is fine.

[00:54:25] And he's like, um, no,

[00:54:28] like I was dead.

[00:54:29] Okay.

[00:54:30] Like I need some time here,

[00:54:32] even though I love you.

[00:54:33] I need some time here.

[00:54:35] And I really like that pick

[00:54:38] and, you know, mentioning Troy

[00:54:39] and the counselor role

[00:54:40] and eventually Hugh ends up in that role.

[00:54:43] So that's really good.

[00:54:45] And the second point that I'll make is,

[00:54:48] yes, Philippa Georgiou, we love it.

[00:54:51] You're totally right.

[00:54:52] Thank you for calling in, Marcy.

[00:54:54] There's a lot I like about this episode.

[00:54:56] I love the, uh,

[00:54:57] the adventure through the mushroom kingdom.

[00:54:59] I love the visual of the discovery, uh,

[00:55:01] half sunk.

[00:55:02] I love right.

[00:55:03] Watching Pike dealing with the bullshit of section 31.

[00:55:06] There's a lot of great stuff there.

[00:55:07] There's a lot of great kind of ingrained drama

[00:55:09] between like Michael and Georgiou,

[00:55:12] but it is,

[00:55:13] it's just like the draw,

[00:55:15] the trauma porn,

[00:55:16] the overly serious opening and closing monologues.

[00:55:20] Just bring it down for me.

[00:55:22] And I'm like, pick a lane discovery.

[00:55:24] If you want to do a fun romp

[00:55:25] through the my serial network

[00:55:26] where they fight a monster,

[00:55:28] great, let's do it.

[00:55:29] But I don't think they did.

[00:55:31] No, I don't know that fun was the tone

[00:55:33] they were going for on this episode,

[00:55:35] but I hear,

[00:55:36] I hear where you're coming from.

[00:55:38] I'm not dismissing you out of hand.

[00:55:40] You're firmly in hand being dismissed.

[00:55:42] Uh, no,

[00:55:43] but to go back to Melanie's point

[00:55:45] and kind of along those same lines, Cameron,

[00:55:48] I, I understand that the shipwide channel speech

[00:55:51] from the captain is a Trek trope,

[00:55:53] uh, but it is there for a reason

[00:55:56] and it absolutely works on me.

[00:55:58] 99% of the time,

[00:56:00] this is a great captain speech.

[00:56:02] I love it.

[00:56:03] It really helps that sense of unity.

[00:56:05] It really reinforces that Pike

[00:56:07] is the kind of captain

[00:56:08] that does care about the people

[00:56:10] that he's working with.

[00:56:11] And I feel like it's a great piece

[00:56:13] of his character to establish

[00:56:15] because we do get to see more of that

[00:56:17] in strange new worlds.

[00:56:18] I think we've mentioned it before,

[00:56:19] but like Uhura basically comes up

[00:56:21] and says like,

[00:56:22] Hey, we need to scrap this

[00:56:23] multi-trillion space dollar project.

[00:56:25] And Pike's like,

[00:56:26] all right, cool.

[00:56:27] Like he just trusts the people

[00:56:29] because he cares about them

[00:56:30] and he knows them on a real level.

[00:56:32] It's not, you know,

[00:56:33] kind of that cold

[00:56:34] and slightly removed Captain Picard

[00:56:36] of the first couple of seasons of TNG.

[00:56:39] It's much more of a season seven

[00:56:40] Captain Picard

[00:56:41] or a movie Captain Picard,

[00:56:43] if you will.

[00:56:44] But we also see that he did get notes

[00:56:47] from Una when she was on the show

[00:56:49] and she said,

[00:56:50] you did the be bold,

[00:56:52] be courageous,

[00:56:53] be brave thing, didn't you?

[00:56:54] Because he doesn't say it again.

[00:56:55] She's like, no, no, no.

[00:56:57] I have told you.

[00:56:58] They all mean the same thing, Chris.

[00:57:00] You can't say that.

[00:57:01] Everybody looks at you weird afterward.

[00:57:03] Don't do the Thor speech every time.

[00:57:07] Also the phrase Godspeed to us all.

[00:57:09] Let's just,

[00:57:10] let's just scaring people.

[00:57:12] You never want to hear Godspeed to us all.

[00:57:17] Especially when you've met God-like beings.

[00:57:19] Yeah.

[00:57:19] That's always nice.

[00:57:20] And it's the opposite of what he says

[00:57:22] in season one of Strange New Worlds,

[00:57:24] which is no one's going to die today,

[00:57:26] which is also like,

[00:57:27] do not make that promise, man.

[00:57:29] You're in space.

[00:57:32] Don't say that out loud.

[00:57:34] I do appreciate that for a show

[00:57:36] that's not afraid to kill people

[00:57:38] or, you know,

[00:57:38] an era of Trek

[00:57:40] that isn't afraid to kill people.

[00:57:41] They're like,

[00:57:42] yeah, we cannot have anybody

[00:57:44] get mangled by this cross-dimensional.

[00:57:46] Like, we'll mention what could happen

[00:57:47] if somebody touches it.

[00:57:48] We're not even going to,

[00:57:49] like, say that anybody,

[00:57:51] but the bridge crew gets close

[00:57:52] because it's like,

[00:57:53] hey, we killed 10 people rescuing one.

[00:57:56] Like, you know,

[00:57:57] they couldn't justify that,

[00:57:59] which I'm glad they were like,

[00:58:00] yeah, we're not going to mention that again

[00:58:01] after we say that thing.

[00:58:03] Well, that is the thing

[00:58:04] about the needs of the mini

[00:58:05] is like,

[00:58:06] Pike goes,

[00:58:07] well, she'd risk her life

[00:58:08] to save any one of us.

[00:58:10] Yeah, that's her choice to make.

[00:58:12] You are making the choice

[00:58:13] for every person on that crew

[00:58:14] to save one kid.

[00:58:15] Okay, Pike, you do you.

[00:58:16] Cameron, everyone in Starfleet

[00:58:18] would make that choice.

[00:58:19] Yeah.

[00:58:20] Apparently.

[00:58:21] Well, then that doesn't make Tilly

[00:58:22] very special.

[00:58:24] Wow.

[00:58:24] Hot take.

[00:58:25] I think Tilly is special.

[00:58:27] I like,

[00:58:27] we got to address the blink and you miss it.

[00:58:30] Hey, what kind of communicator

[00:58:31] is that from Pike

[00:58:32] when Ash calls for help?

[00:58:34] Okay, Section 31 ship

[00:58:35] is just hanging out there

[00:58:37] waiting for Tyler to call for help.

[00:58:39] We're like,

[00:58:39] okay, we're here.

[00:58:40] Like, did you guys have

[00:58:42] nothing else going on?

[00:58:43] Were you literally just like,

[00:58:44] did nobody say,

[00:58:45] hey, there's a comet

[00:58:46] flying behind Discovery

[00:58:47] the whole time

[00:58:48] we're traveling here?

[00:58:49] So, I get you,

[00:58:51] but I think that plays into

[00:58:53] Pike being so upset about it

[00:58:54] because it's like,

[00:58:55] okay, clearly they were spying on you

[00:58:57] because they figured

[00:58:58] Pike and Burnham

[00:58:59] are the best lead we have

[00:59:00] on Spock right now.

[00:59:02] Let's just tail him

[00:59:02] and pretend to be a rock.

[00:59:04] Like, I get it,

[00:59:07] but yeah,

[00:59:07] there were a few things

[00:59:08] in this episode

[00:59:09] where I was like,

[00:59:09] all right,

[00:59:10] that's convenient.

[00:59:10] But don't worry,

[00:59:12] there will be more of those

[00:59:13] in this season,

[00:59:13] I promise you.

[00:59:15] Oh, yeah.

[00:59:17] But, you know,

[00:59:18] along that same

[00:59:20] speechification

[00:59:20] and closing narration

[00:59:22] topic,

[00:59:24] I think Michael's

[00:59:25] closing narration

[00:59:26] actually hit me

[00:59:27] a little hard this week.

[00:59:28] Like,

[00:59:28] she talks about

[00:59:29] moments of clarity,

[00:59:31] instances of

[00:59:32] understanding the path ahead

[00:59:34] before it becomes cloudy again,

[00:59:35] and I just,

[00:59:37] I think that's something

[00:59:38] that has real value

[00:59:39] right now.

[00:59:40] Like,

[00:59:40] hold on to your

[00:59:41] moments of joy

[00:59:42] and live in your

[00:59:44] moments of clarity

[00:59:45] and be present

[00:59:46] on your path

[00:59:47] because it's going to

[00:59:49] help you stay strong

[00:59:50] even when the clouds

[00:59:52] end up gathering

[00:59:52] on your horizon.

[00:59:53] Just choose to walk

[00:59:55] forward together

[00:59:56] and keep that

[00:59:58] as part of who you are.

[01:00:00] I think that's

[01:00:00] a very good message

[01:00:02] to have

[01:00:03] in a show

[01:00:04] that we're watching

[01:00:04] right now,

[01:00:05] and I was glad

[01:00:05] to have it

[01:00:06] delivered by somebody

[01:00:07] I respect,

[01:00:08] like a Starfleet officer.

[01:00:09] That's very

[01:00:11] thoughtful

[01:00:12] and

[01:00:13] introspective of you.

[01:00:14] Are you saying

[01:00:15] it's out of character?

[01:00:16] That makes it sound

[01:00:16] good, yeah.

[01:00:18] No,

[01:00:19] but my

[01:00:20] problem with the ending,

[01:00:21] the tone of the ending,

[01:00:22] is,

[01:00:23] I mean,

[01:00:24] it's not

[01:00:25] super downbeat,

[01:00:26] but it's more downbeat

[01:00:27] than even bittersweet.

[01:00:28] Like,

[01:00:28] she's not...

[01:00:30] Michael,

[01:00:31] in the last couple days,

[01:00:32] you had three

[01:00:33] close friends

[01:00:34] you either thought

[01:00:35] were dead,

[01:00:36] gone forever,

[01:00:37] or that you were

[01:00:38] about to have to kill

[01:00:39] with certainty,

[01:00:39] each and every one of them,

[01:00:41] and each and one of them

[01:00:42] are right now alive

[01:00:43] and,

[01:00:44] well,

[01:00:44] they're not healthy.

[01:00:46] Colbert's got some healing

[01:00:47] to do,

[01:00:47] but they're all alive.

[01:00:48] And it's been a good

[01:00:49] couple days,

[01:00:50] Michael.

[01:00:50] This is a good couple.

[01:00:51] You should be overjoyed

[01:00:52] right now.

[01:00:53] They're all alive.

[01:00:54] But she's also

[01:00:55] gotta be exhausted.

[01:00:57] And, like,

[01:00:58] I think...

[01:00:59] Well, yes,

[01:00:59] that's true.

[01:01:00] Emotionally drained.

[01:01:01] You're right.

[01:01:01] And I think that's where

[01:01:02] she's coming from,

[01:01:02] is like,

[01:01:03] look,

[01:01:03] I was sure

[01:01:04] this was gonna suck,

[01:01:06] but, like,

[01:01:06] if you just keep

[01:01:07] moving forward,

[01:01:09] things might actually

[01:01:10] end up

[01:01:11] not only okay,

[01:01:12] but good.

[01:01:13] And it can be difficult

[01:01:15] to see that

[01:01:16] when you're in those moments,

[01:01:17] right?

[01:01:17] So I think it really

[01:01:19] just speaks to how

[01:01:20] truly

[01:01:21] through the ringer

[01:01:22] this whole crew

[01:01:23] has been,

[01:01:24] but Michael in particular,

[01:01:25] as you mentioned,

[01:01:26] it's like,

[01:01:27] dude,

[01:01:27] you're gonna need

[01:01:28] a minute to breathe

[01:01:30] before you can even

[01:01:31] realize things worked out.

[01:01:33] And I think it kind of

[01:01:35] leaves us on that

[01:01:35] because it shows

[01:01:36] the moment of her

[01:01:37] with Tilly,

[01:01:38] where Tilly is,

[01:01:39] you know,

[01:01:39] like,

[01:01:40] starting to process

[01:01:40] that loss of May.

[01:01:42] The second time

[01:01:43] she's lost May,

[01:01:44] arguably.

[01:01:44] Maybe even the third.

[01:01:46] Yeah,

[01:01:46] that's kind of

[01:01:47] the resolution of...

[01:01:49] It's been,

[01:01:50] like,

[01:01:50] three episodes

[01:01:51] that little storyline

[01:01:52] has been developing,

[01:01:53] right?

[01:01:53] So the end of this episode

[01:01:54] almost felt like

[01:01:55] a little reset,

[01:01:56] almost like a mid-season.

[01:01:58] You know,

[01:01:58] Ash is now

[01:01:59] part of the crew.

[01:02:00] Tilly's little May arc

[01:02:02] is concluded.

[01:02:03] You know,

[01:02:04] the order for

[01:02:06] Section 31

[01:02:07] to work with Discovery

[01:02:08] to continue to find Spock.

[01:02:09] It's like,

[01:02:10] okay,

[01:02:10] marching orders again.

[01:02:13] And we've mentioned

[01:02:14] multiple...

[01:02:15] I've said it

[01:02:15] almost every episode,

[01:02:16] like,

[01:02:16] I have forgotten

[01:02:17] so much about this season

[01:02:18] that I'm just rediscovering.

[01:02:19] Now,

[01:02:20] as I watch,

[01:02:21] I remember stuff that happens.

[01:02:22] I keep waiting

[01:02:23] for the next plot points.

[01:02:25] I'm like,

[01:02:25] I know,

[01:02:26] like,

[01:02:27] Arium.

[01:02:27] I know,

[01:02:28] like,

[01:02:28] there are certain things

[01:02:29] coming up.

[01:02:29] Like,

[01:02:30] when does that happen?

[01:02:31] And like we talked about before,

[01:02:32] when the hell does Spock show up

[01:02:34] in the season about Spock?

[01:02:35] I swear he's in it.

[01:02:37] I was listening to

[01:02:38] some of your earlier episodes

[01:02:40] this season,

[01:02:40] and I think something

[01:02:41] you guys brought up

[01:02:42] was how

[01:02:42] the Red Angel plot line,

[01:02:44] or at this point,

[01:02:45] I guess,

[01:02:45] the Red Signal,

[01:02:47] does really keep you interested.

[01:02:49] I mean,

[01:02:49] up until this point

[01:02:50] in the season,

[01:02:50] I think it is.

[01:02:51] Like,

[01:02:52] it doesn't really lose

[01:02:52] its intrigue

[01:02:55] as a mystery

[01:02:56] for the season.

[01:02:56] And I was comparing

[01:02:57] that in my head

[01:02:58] to,

[01:02:59] do you remember

[01:02:59] the Red Vines

[01:03:00] from Picard season three?

[01:03:01] Yes.

[01:03:02] And how that was a mystery

[01:03:03] throughout the season.

[01:03:04] And for me,

[01:03:04] I don't know,

[01:03:05] personally,

[01:03:05] for me,

[01:03:06] that really lost

[01:03:07] its mystery

[01:03:08] and intrigue

[01:03:09] very,

[01:03:10] very quickly.

[01:03:10] But this one is

[01:03:11] doing a way better job

[01:03:13] of keeping us interested

[01:03:14] in what's going on

[01:03:15] with the Red Signal.

[01:03:16] So I think it's really successful

[01:03:18] in that regard.

[01:03:19] Wendy,

[01:03:19] I remember people

[01:03:20] during season three

[01:03:21] of Picard going,

[01:03:22] oh,

[01:03:22] this has to be connected

[01:03:23] to the Red Angel

[01:03:24] from Discovery.

[01:03:25] Why else would they

[01:03:26] use the red color?

[01:03:27] And I'm like,

[01:03:28] oh,

[01:03:28] just you wait.

[01:03:29] They don't care

[01:03:30] about consistency.

[01:03:31] Like,

[01:03:32] they will do literally

[01:03:33] whatever they want.

[01:03:34] If you want to hear more

[01:03:36] about how I feel

[01:03:37] about Picard season three,

[01:03:39] I don't know,

[01:03:39] maybe find me on Blue Sky

[01:03:41] or ask me in the Discord

[01:03:42] because I have

[01:03:43] very conflicted feelings

[01:03:44] about it.

[01:03:44] And I won't get

[01:03:45] into them here

[01:03:46] because Cameron

[01:03:47] has not yet seen it

[01:03:48] and we're very excited

[01:03:50] for him to see it.

[01:03:51] Oh,

[01:03:51] man,

[01:03:51] I cannot wait.

[01:03:52] I just want licorice

[01:03:53] right now.

[01:03:53] I have,

[01:03:54] Cameron,

[01:03:55] I've,

[01:03:55] you're going to love it.

[01:03:56] I've started making my notes

[01:03:57] because I'm going to do

[01:03:58] a segment on each one.

[01:03:59] I'm going to start predicting

[01:04:00] what Cam's going to feel

[01:04:01] about every episode.

[01:04:02] Oh,

[01:04:02] man.

[01:04:03] As he watches them.

[01:04:04] So,

[01:04:04] yeah.

[01:04:04] I'm so excited.

[01:04:05] Before we get to our songs,

[01:04:07] John,

[01:04:07] I want to give people

[01:04:09] the true reason

[01:04:10] that we're all here

[01:04:11] and why we invited

[01:04:12] Wendy to come speak with us.

[01:04:14] Wendy,

[01:04:15] be honest.

[01:04:16] What's the worst part

[01:04:17] of working with Adam and Ben?

[01:04:19] That's got to be

[01:04:19] so difficult,

[01:04:20] right?

[01:04:21] Like,

[01:04:21] I'm totally kidding.

[01:04:22] We had a ton of fun

[01:04:23] with them

[01:04:24] and we always do.

[01:04:25] We had a lot of fun in Vegas.

[01:04:26] They're the best.

[01:04:27] It really does seem

[01:04:28] like a dream job.

[01:04:29] So,

[01:04:29] yes,

[01:04:30] there's some jealousy here,

[01:04:31] but like,

[01:04:31] you are so good

[01:04:33] at what you do.

[01:04:34] Like,

[01:04:35] if you go back

[01:04:35] and listen to the episodes

[01:04:36] from before you joined the team

[01:04:38] and then listen to the episodes

[01:04:40] after,

[01:04:41] there are no beats missed.

[01:04:42] It is like the exact same voice,

[01:04:44] the exact same pattern.

[01:04:46] Everything worked so well.

[01:04:48] They could not have picked

[01:04:49] a better producer.

[01:04:50] So,

[01:04:50] I want to say thank you

[01:04:51] for keeping Greatest Trek

[01:04:52] and Greatest Generation

[01:04:53] at the quality

[01:04:54] that it has always been at.

[01:04:55] And thank you,

[01:04:56] of course,

[01:04:56] for joining us.

[01:04:59] Thanks,

[01:04:59] Jesse.

[01:05:00] That's so nice to hear.

[01:05:01] And yeah,

[01:05:01] Ben and Adam are great

[01:05:02] to work for.

[01:05:03] Every day

[01:05:04] at work

[01:05:05] is hilarious.

[01:05:06] I can't even,

[01:05:07] yeah.

[01:05:07] In that sense,

[01:05:08] it really is a dream job.

[01:05:10] Yeah.

[01:05:10] And to all of our listeners

[01:05:11] out there,

[01:05:11] take it from three guys

[01:05:12] who know firsthand

[01:05:14] of those three,

[01:05:15] Wendy is hands down

[01:05:16] the best karaoke singer.

[01:05:17] Like,

[01:05:18] it's not even a competition

[01:05:21] by a mile.

[01:05:22] They've got the performance.

[01:05:23] I've got the actual

[01:05:24] trained voice.

[01:05:26] I would go so far

[01:05:27] as to say.

[01:05:28] You can't really beat

[01:05:29] Ben's karaoke game.

[01:05:31] I mean,

[01:05:32] I would go so far

[01:05:33] as to say

[01:05:33] Wendy is the best karaoke singer

[01:05:35] out of all five

[01:05:36] of the Star Trek podcast hosts

[01:05:38] that we're talking about here,

[01:05:40] us three included.

[01:05:41] But yeah,

[01:05:42] that was safe.

[01:05:43] When we're included,

[01:05:43] the six,

[01:05:44] yeah.

[01:05:44] That was a lot of fun.

[01:05:46] But speaking of karaoke,

[01:05:48] I did it,

[01:05:49] John.

[01:05:49] I got back to it.

[01:05:50] There you go.

[01:05:50] There you go.

[01:05:52] Well,

[01:05:53] we do pick a song.

[01:05:54] We each pick a song

[01:05:55] that we feel represents

[01:05:56] each episode

[01:05:57] as we watch it.

[01:05:58] Wendy,

[01:05:59] do you want to start us off

[01:06:00] this week

[01:06:00] and give us your song pick?

[01:06:02] absolutely.

[01:06:02] All right.

[01:06:02] I was deeply inspired

[01:06:04] and moved by Stamets'

[01:06:06] line read of

[01:06:08] see you on the other side

[01:06:09] with the finger point,

[01:06:11] like the overhand finger point

[01:06:12] and everything.

[01:06:13] And so I am bringing

[01:06:15] the 1995

[01:06:17] Ozzy Osbourne song

[01:06:19] See You on the Other Side.

[01:06:21] Should I read out

[01:06:22] some lyrics for you?

[01:06:23] Yeah, please.

[01:06:23] Absolutely.

[01:06:24] Okay.

[01:06:25] Never thought I'd feel like this.

[01:06:26] Strange to be alone.

[01:06:28] Yeah.

[01:06:28] But we'll be together

[01:06:29] carved in stone.

[01:06:31] Hold me,

[01:06:32] hold me tight,

[01:06:32] I'm falling.

[01:06:33] Far away,

[01:06:34] distant voices calling.

[01:06:35] I'm so cold.

[01:06:36] I need you, darling.

[01:06:37] Yeah.

[01:06:37] Wow.

[01:06:38] I was down,

[01:06:39] but now I'm flying.

[01:06:40] Straight across the great divide,

[01:06:41] I know you're crying,

[01:06:42] but I'll stop you crying.

[01:06:43] When I see you,

[01:06:44] see you on the other side.

[01:06:46] So good.

[01:06:47] That's an excellent pick.

[01:06:49] Man.

[01:06:50] Yeah.

[01:06:50] I think everybody knows

[01:06:51] that Ozzy Osbourne

[01:06:52] is a pretty big

[01:06:53] Star Trek Discovery fan,

[01:06:55] right?

[01:06:55] Like,

[01:06:55] that's common knowledge.

[01:06:58] Yeah.

[01:06:59] It's crazy how often

[01:07:00] we're able to find songs

[01:07:01] that feel like

[01:07:02] they were written

[01:07:03] about the episode,

[01:07:04] and I'm sure that's down

[01:07:05] to music being

[01:07:06] universal language

[01:07:06] and everything.

[01:07:08] But yeah,

[01:07:08] that is a-

[01:07:09] Crazy train.

[01:07:09] That is a killer good-

[01:07:10] Oh, yeah.

[01:07:11] I see what you got there.

[01:07:11] That is a very good pick.

[01:07:13] No,

[01:07:13] are you kidding me?

[01:07:14] Is that meatloaf?

[01:07:17] I take back

[01:07:18] all the nice stuff

[01:07:19] I said, Cameron.

[01:07:23] Well,

[01:07:24] I was very tempted

[01:07:24] to use the

[01:07:25] Super Mario Brothers rap,

[01:07:27] of course,

[01:07:28] from Mario Brothers

[01:07:28] the movie.

[01:07:29] John,

[01:07:30] go ahead and put

[01:07:30] something here.

[01:07:31] We're the Mario Brothers

[01:07:32] and Plummin's a game.

[01:07:34] We're not like the others

[01:07:35] who get all the fame.

[01:07:37] But I won't,

[01:07:38] although I will say

[01:07:38] I apologize to all people

[01:07:40] who now,

[01:07:41] when they rewatch season one,

[01:07:42] hear the Mario death

[01:07:43] sound effect

[01:07:43] when Culbert dies,

[01:07:44] because you will

[01:07:45] from now on.

[01:07:48] No,

[01:07:49] I did not go that route.

[01:07:50] I went a different way

[01:07:52] in an episode

[01:07:53] that I think

[01:07:55] on a meta level,

[01:07:56] I feel like

[01:07:57] really wants to be together,

[01:07:59] but just doesn't quite work

[01:08:01] because of certain tonal shifts.

[01:08:03] Also,

[01:08:04] the themes of the episode,

[01:08:05] I feel,

[01:08:05] are very much

[01:08:06] people living in two worlds,

[01:08:08] right?

[01:08:08] We have the visual representation

[01:08:10] of the discovery

[01:08:11] stuck between two worlds.

[01:08:12] We have

[01:08:12] Pike

[01:08:13] living within

[01:08:15] his Starfleet world,

[01:08:16] but also having to dabble

[01:08:17] in Section 31's

[01:08:19] world of gray areas

[01:08:20] and everything.

[01:08:21] We've got

[01:08:22] Tilly

[01:08:24] dealing with

[01:08:26] her emotions

[01:08:27] of being mad at May,

[01:08:28] but also feeling sorry

[01:08:29] and needing to help her

[01:08:30] and all that.

[01:08:31] And then we have

[01:08:33] people

[01:08:35] being pulled apart,

[01:08:37] people who were once together

[01:08:38] being pulled apart,

[01:08:39] right?

[01:08:39] We have

[01:08:40] the backstory

[01:08:41] of Stamets

[01:08:41] and Culbert,

[01:08:42] and they're finally

[01:08:43] getting to reunite,

[01:08:44] but it's looking shaky

[01:08:45] there for a while.

[01:08:46] They don't know

[01:08:47] if it's going to work.

[01:08:47] We've got

[01:08:48] Georgiou

[01:08:49] and Michael,

[01:08:50] right?

[01:08:50] Like,

[01:08:51] once her mentor

[01:08:53] and now,

[01:08:53] you know,

[01:08:54] she's realizing

[01:08:55] Emperor Georgiou

[01:08:55] is not the person

[01:08:57] she wanted her to be

[01:08:58] when she brought her

[01:08:58] back into the prime timeline.

[01:08:59] We've got Pike

[01:09:00] and Leland,

[01:09:02] of course,

[01:09:03] old friends

[01:09:03] now being pulled apart.

[01:09:05] So,

[01:09:05] I had to go

[01:09:07] with

[01:09:07] Here we stand,

[01:09:09] worlds apart,

[01:09:11] hearts broken

[01:09:11] in two,

[01:09:12] two,

[01:09:13] two,

[01:09:14] sleepless nights,

[01:09:15] losing ground.

[01:09:16] I'm reaching for you,

[01:09:17] you,

[01:09:17] and you.

[01:09:18] It's

[01:09:18] journeys

[01:09:18] separate ways.

[01:09:21] It's all about,

[01:09:22] like,

[01:09:22] you know,

[01:09:23] people you want,

[01:09:24] being with someone

[01:09:25] that worked for a moment

[01:09:26] and now you see them

[01:09:27] going away,

[01:09:28] but there's a promise

[01:09:29] in there.

[01:09:30] There's a promise

[01:09:30] that you will reach out

[01:09:31] for them when the time comes

[01:09:32] and perhaps

[01:09:33] in some of these cases

[01:09:34] they will be back together,

[01:09:35] but not all of them.

[01:09:36] It doesn't always work out

[01:09:37] that way.

[01:09:38] I like that.

[01:09:40] Journey.

[01:09:40] Journey's the song

[01:09:41] that ties it all together.

[01:09:42] I was sure.

[01:09:43] Journey's the band

[01:09:44] that ties it all together

[01:09:45] with their songs.

[01:09:46] I was sure you were

[01:09:47] going to do

[01:09:47] Reunited by Peaches and Herb,

[01:09:49] so I'm glad that you didn't.

[01:09:51] Don't know that one.

[01:09:52] Don't know it.

[01:09:53] You know that song

[01:09:54] and if you heard it,

[01:09:54] you go,

[01:09:54] oh,

[01:09:55] I know this song.

[01:09:56] But I was for sure

[01:09:58] you were going to set up

[01:09:59] this big,

[01:10:00] long,

[01:10:00] poignant explanation

[01:10:01] that'd be like,

[01:10:02] here's kind of a funny song.

[01:10:03] But I actually,

[01:10:04] I really liked that pick,

[01:10:06] Cameron.

[01:10:06] I think,

[01:10:06] I think I got to Journey

[01:10:08] first in our season five

[01:10:10] disco coverage,

[01:10:11] but I mean,

[01:10:13] it's never a bad day

[01:10:14] to listen to Journey.

[01:10:16] Right.

[01:10:16] No.

[01:10:17] In separate ways,

[01:10:18] in my book,

[01:10:20] their second best song

[01:10:21] because of course,

[01:10:22] Wheel in the Sky.

[01:10:23] I believe it was just

[01:10:24] one of the best songs

[01:10:24] of all time.

[01:10:25] None of their

[01:10:26] au revoir

[01:10:26] is going to top that.

[01:10:29] I went with

[01:10:30] a little more

[01:10:31] broad approach.

[01:10:32] I was thinking,

[01:10:33] okay,

[01:10:34] like look into this episode

[01:10:35] in what,

[01:10:36] 2019,

[01:10:36] I think when this came out

[01:10:38] and just the world

[01:10:39] it was being released in,

[01:10:41] I'm sure Paramount

[01:10:43] was looking around

[01:10:43] and saying,

[01:10:44] man,

[01:10:45] you know,

[01:10:45] we are trying to

[01:10:47] bootstrap new Star Trek

[01:10:48] with this.

[01:10:49] That first season

[01:10:50] was pretty well received,

[01:10:51] obviously got renewed

[01:10:52] and they're starting

[01:10:52] to talk about other

[01:10:53] types of Star Trek

[01:10:55] and other shows

[01:10:55] and,

[01:10:56] you know,

[01:10:56] not knowing yet

[01:10:57] that there's about

[01:10:57] to be five different

[01:10:59] Star Treks on

[01:11:00] in the same year,

[01:11:01] which is,

[01:11:02] it's still an insane thing

[01:11:03] that we got to live

[01:11:04] in a time when that happened.

[01:11:05] But it was,

[01:11:06] you know,

[01:11:07] they had competition,

[01:11:09] stuff was just

[01:11:09] picking up more and more

[01:11:10] so they had to

[01:11:11] look and see

[01:11:12] what worked

[01:11:13] and they're like,

[01:11:14] well,

[01:11:15] we know that

[01:11:16] people really like

[01:11:17] Michelle Yeoh,

[01:11:18] really like Philippa George,

[01:11:19] we got to bring her back.

[01:11:20] People have been missing

[01:11:21] her barbs

[01:11:22] and they're like,

[01:11:22] oh,

[01:11:22] missing Barb.

[01:11:23] That's right.

[01:11:24] So my pick is

[01:11:26] the Stranger Things

[01:11:27] theme song

[01:11:27] because this is

[01:11:29] absolutely just

[01:11:29] the upside down

[01:11:31] and the Stranger Things

[01:11:32] episode.

[01:11:33] They're like,

[01:11:34] hey,

[01:11:34] it's working for them.

[01:11:36] Why don't we just

[01:11:37] have an episode

[01:11:37] where we do

[01:11:38] the same exact

[01:11:39] thing they do

[01:11:40] in that show

[01:11:41] and put some

[01:11:42] Star Trek in it.

[01:11:43] So,

[01:11:44] yeah,

[01:11:44] I'm going with

[01:11:44] the Stranger Things

[01:11:45] theme song.

[01:11:46] That's a really good call,

[01:11:48] John.

[01:11:48] I actually

[01:11:49] paused the episode,

[01:11:50] looked up the premiere

[01:11:51] date of Stranger Things

[01:11:52] and was like,

[01:11:53] is this,

[01:11:54] did they see,

[01:11:55] and yes,

[01:11:55] it is possible

[01:11:56] that they saw

[01:11:57] the upside down

[01:11:57] and went,

[01:11:58] we could do that,

[01:11:58] but with science.

[01:11:59] Yeah.

[01:12:00] Air quotes,

[01:12:01] science.

[01:12:02] I like that.

[01:12:03] And you know what?

[01:12:03] I can't wait to listen

[01:12:04] to this episode

[01:12:05] because that theme song,

[01:12:06] even though it doesn't

[01:12:07] have any like explanation

[01:12:08] of the premise of the show

[01:12:09] like an 80s sitcom does,

[01:12:11] it's still a good theme song.

[01:12:12] Oh,

[01:12:12] yeah,

[01:12:12] it's a great theme.

[01:12:13] Yeah.

[01:12:14] But I think all theme songs

[01:12:15] should have that.

[01:12:16] All right.

[01:12:17] So,

[01:12:18] I have continued

[01:12:21] in my belief

[01:12:22] that this season

[01:12:24] of Discovery

[01:12:25] is so metal

[01:12:26] in so many ways

[01:12:27] and that's why

[01:12:28] I'm trying to build

[01:12:29] kind of like

[01:12:30] a very heavy soundtrack

[01:12:31] with my song picks

[01:12:33] for this season

[01:12:34] of Discovery.

[01:12:35] This episode,

[01:12:36] I think,

[01:12:38] fits really well

[01:12:39] with a motionless

[01:12:40] and white song

[01:12:41] called Another Life.

[01:12:42] It has lyrics like,

[01:12:44] with a candle

[01:12:45] through time

[01:12:46] I could still

[01:12:47] see your ghost

[01:12:48] but I can't

[01:12:49] close my eyes

[01:12:49] for it

[01:12:50] is there

[01:12:50] where you haunt

[01:12:51] me most.

[01:12:52] I hate

[01:12:54] that it seemed

[01:12:55] that you were

[01:12:55] never enough.

[01:12:56] We were broken

[01:12:57] and bleeding

[01:12:57] but never gave up

[01:12:59] and I hope

[01:13:00] that I stain

[01:13:00] through your memory

[01:13:01] as we echo

[01:13:02] through time

[01:13:03] in the melody

[01:13:04] and then of course

[01:13:05] the chorus says

[01:13:06] I hope that we meet

[01:13:07] in Another Life

[01:13:08] which is just

[01:13:10] Stamets and Culber

[01:13:11] all the way through,

[01:13:12] right?

[01:13:13] And you have

[01:13:13] as you were mentioning

[01:13:15] Georgiou and Michael

[01:13:16] meeting in a literal

[01:13:17] Another Life.

[01:13:18] She used to be

[01:13:19] in the other universe.

[01:13:21] You've got Leland

[01:13:22] and Pike

[01:13:23] meeting in Another Life.

[01:13:24] No man,

[01:13:24] we're not in the academy

[01:13:25] class together anymore.

[01:13:26] Now I'm

[01:13:27] a hairless

[01:13:28] section 31

[01:13:30] D-bag

[01:13:31] and you are

[01:13:32] the coolest

[01:13:33] captain possibly ever.

[01:13:35] So it's

[01:13:36] got the barriers

[01:13:37] between people,

[01:13:38] it's got that

[01:13:39] time thing going on.

[01:13:41] My pick for this week

[01:13:42] is Another Life

[01:13:43] by Motionless

[01:13:44] in White.

[01:13:45] I love how Jesse

[01:13:46] makes these picks

[01:13:47] that obviously

[01:13:48] Cam and I

[01:13:49] have never,

[01:13:49] ever,

[01:13:50] ever heard of.

[01:13:50] So anytime we're like,

[01:13:52] oh,

[01:13:52] that's a great pig,

[01:13:53] for Jesse,

[01:13:54] we're like,

[01:13:54] they're just being nice.

[01:13:56] Yep,

[01:13:56] thumbs up.

[01:13:58] Sure,

[01:13:59] it's great.

[01:14:00] Those lyrics sound good.

[01:14:01] I will get you guys

[01:14:03] into metal,

[01:14:03] I swear.

[01:14:06] Yeah,

[01:14:07] because in your early 40s

[01:14:08] is a time when your

[01:14:09] musical taste really change,

[01:14:11] you know,

[01:14:11] when you really just

[01:14:12] keep it fresh.

[01:14:15] And then the one time

[01:14:16] he was like,

[01:14:17] I don't know if you guys

[01:14:17] understand this music

[01:14:18] or know it,

[01:14:19] but Gunship,

[01:14:20] the synth wave.

[01:14:22] I'm like,

[01:14:22] yes,

[01:14:22] I know Gunship,

[01:14:23] Jesse.

[01:14:24] That's my type of music

[01:14:25] right there.

[01:14:26] It's a YouTube band.

[01:14:27] I figured nobody knows

[01:14:28] any YouTube band

[01:14:29] because the distribution

[01:14:30] is all messed up now

[01:14:31] for music,

[01:14:32] but I don't know.

[01:14:34] It's one of those,

[01:14:35] you know,

[01:14:36] I think it's one of the few

[01:14:37] ways we can offer

[01:14:38] that last little bit

[01:14:39] of personal stank

[01:14:40] for our analysis,

[01:14:41] right?

[01:14:41] Because it really helps

[01:14:43] people get to know

[01:14:44] what we're thinking about.

[01:14:46] And I'll just say,

[01:14:46] you know,

[01:14:47] if you guys would look inward,

[01:14:48] I think you might start

[01:14:50] just throwing it out there.

[01:14:51] This has been a great discussion

[01:14:53] of Saints of Imperfection.

[01:14:54] Wendy,

[01:14:55] thank you very much

[01:14:56] for joining us.

[01:14:57] Thank you for having me.

[01:14:59] You are a saint of imperfection.

[01:15:01] What do you have to plug?

[01:15:04] Well,

[01:15:05] Greatest Trek

[01:15:05] is covering Lower Decks

[01:15:06] Season 5 right now.

[01:15:08] We recently had

[01:15:09] our 300th episode,

[01:15:11] which is really

[01:15:12] a fun milestone.

[01:15:13] Tani Newsome joined

[01:15:14] for that episode.

[01:15:16] if you're interested

[01:15:16] in hearing episode

[01:15:17] by episode coverage

[01:15:18] of Lower Decks,

[01:15:19] head on over

[01:15:20] to Greatest Trek.

[01:15:21] And of course,

[01:15:22] Greatest Gen continues

[01:15:23] to plot its way

[01:15:25] through Enterprise

[01:15:26] Season 2.

[01:15:28] That's fantastic.

[01:15:29] I cannot wait

[01:15:29] until you guys

[01:15:30] get to Season 3.

[01:15:31] That's one of my favorite

[01:15:33] Star Trek arcs ever

[01:15:35] is Season 3.

[01:15:36] Yeah,

[01:15:38] it's been a lot of fun.

[01:15:39] Excellent,

[01:15:39] excellent.

[01:15:41] Cam,

[01:15:42] where can folks

[01:15:43] hear you

[01:15:43] when you're not

[01:15:44] re-watching Discovery

[01:15:45] and loving every minute

[01:15:47] of it?

[01:15:48] Every minute?

[01:15:48] No,

[01:15:49] it's fun.

[01:15:50] But over on TNG

[01:15:52] where they don't

[01:15:53] take things quite

[01:15:54] so seriously

[01:15:54] and can just allow

[01:15:55] a good

[01:15:56] de-evolutionary romp

[01:15:58] via de-evolutionary romp,

[01:15:59] we're finishing up

[01:16:01] Season 7

[01:16:01] of The Next Generation

[01:16:03] just episode,

[01:16:04] there's five,

[01:16:04] five episodes

[01:16:05] of TNG

[01:16:06] I've never seen now.

[01:16:07] Wow.

[01:16:07] Probably four by the time

[01:16:08] you all listen to this,

[01:16:09] so pretty crazy.

[01:16:10] Come check us out over there.

[01:16:11] We'll have some fun

[01:16:12] bonus coverage

[01:16:13] and then movies

[01:16:14] and as has been

[01:16:15] teased a lot this episode,

[01:16:16] Picard after that.

[01:16:18] Excellent.

[01:16:18] Jesse,

[01:16:19] we had some great callers

[01:16:20] tonight.

[01:16:21] Folks want to lend

[01:16:22] their voices to Open Pike.

[01:16:23] Join us on the

[01:16:23] Open Pike Night stage.

[01:16:24] How can they do that?

[01:16:26] The easiest way

[01:16:27] to add your voice

[01:16:28] to the chorus

[01:16:29] of wonderful fans

[01:16:30] here on the

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[01:16:34] It has everything

[01:16:35] you need for the show

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[01:16:37] You can record your voice

[01:16:38] right there directly.

[01:16:39] All you need

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[01:16:40] If you prefer to send

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[01:16:43] Send it to

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[01:16:46] And if you just

[01:16:47] want to hang out

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[01:16:51] plant your flags

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[01:16:53] with us on social media,

[01:16:54] the best place

[01:16:55] for you to do that

[01:16:56] is openpike.bsky.social.

[01:16:58] We have made the leap

[01:17:00] as many folks have

[01:17:02] over from

[01:17:02] the completely dead

[01:17:03] and useless Twitter

[01:17:04] to the very fun

[01:17:06] and welcoming

[01:17:07] Blue Sky.

[01:17:08] And as of this recording,

[01:17:10] we have

[01:17:11] very nearly

[01:17:12] the same number

[01:17:14] of followers

[01:17:14] on Blue Sky

[01:17:15] as we had

[01:17:16] on Twitter

[01:17:17] when we left

[01:17:17] and we've been active

[01:17:18] on Blue Sky

[01:17:19] for like maybe a month.

[01:17:20] So I promise you

[01:17:22] the atmosphere

[01:17:23] is welcoming,

[01:17:24] the discussion

[01:17:24] is happening,

[01:17:25] come hang out

[01:17:26] on Blue Sky

[01:17:27] with Open Pike Night.

[01:17:30] Fantastic.

[01:17:31] Well, it's been

[01:17:31] a long night

[01:17:32] and somebody

[01:17:33] ordered a pizza

[01:17:34] to the Open Pike Night

[01:17:35] backstage

[01:17:35] that has mushrooms

[01:17:37] on it.

[01:17:37] Come on, guys,

[01:17:38] after this episode,

[01:17:39] which one of you

[01:17:40] did that?

[01:17:41] We gotta go,

[01:17:41] we gotta get

[01:17:42] to the bottom

[01:17:42] of this

[01:17:42] because it's also

[01:17:43] starting to get

[01:17:43] a little gooey

[01:17:44] and slimy.

[01:17:45] That one right there

[01:17:46] is May.

[01:17:46] Oh, okay.

[01:17:47] The juicy one, yeah.

[01:17:49] I think I see

[01:17:50] the pizza cutter

[01:17:51] coming in.

[01:17:53] Looks a lot

[01:17:54] like Discovery.

[01:17:56] Mycelial Pizza,

[01:17:57] what do you want?

[01:18:00] Thank you once again

[01:18:01] for listening to

[01:18:02] Open Pike Night.

[01:18:03] I am producer John

[01:18:04] with Cam and Jesse.

[01:18:06] You can go anywhere

[01:18:07] you want,

[01:18:07] but you can't stay here.