Stream of Thought - Onitra Johnson on TOS' "Devil in the Dark"

[00:00:00] Welcome to Open Pike Night. I'm your host this week, Jesse Bailey, and of course I am here with Cameron Greenshirt Harrison, who is watching TNG for the very first time. Cameron, how are you doing tonight?

[00:00:38] I'm doing well, although I have seen much TOS in my past. I had not seen this one, I was excited to check it out. It was super fun, and I'm excited to watch it tonight with you all.

[00:00:49] And producer John this week is away making toys for all the good girls and boys, so he will not be joining us, but he is here in spirit, and he knows whether you've been naughty

[00:01:00] or nice, so please behave. Now of course Cameron was referring to our Stream of Thought series, where we bring on Star Trek professionals and we watch some Star Trek with them, or whatever it was that inspired one of their more recent episodes. You may remember we sat down

[00:01:18] with Davey Perez to watch Star Trek 6, and he told us all about how that had some influence over Under the Cloak of War. This week we are very excited to welcome back Onitra Johnson,

[00:01:31] and we are going to be watching TOS' The Devil in the Dark. Onitra, welcome, how are you doing? I'm good, I'm very much ready for Christmas to be over in a good way.

[00:01:45] Yeah, I heard that, it's a lot of build up. It's a lot of build up. The end of the year is always like this, but otherwise I'm really great, we're back at work, strikes over, everything's

[00:01:57] gearing up really quickly and just excited to see what next year brings. That was going to be one of our first questions to confirm you are back for Season 3 then. Oh, yeah.

[00:02:07] Exciting. Very cool. Now if you want to watch along at home or listen along if you're here for the audio version of this show, again we are watching The Devil in the Dark which is TOS

[00:02:21] Season 1 Episode 25. Now if you're here with us live, you don't need to watch along because we've got you covered for that. Cameron, is there anything else we need to get to before we jump in?

[00:02:34] I don't think so. Well, So Aditra, I was wondering, you wrote Lost in Translation which this episode inspired you said, were you tasked with Lost in Translation? Was that an episode you

[00:02:45] fought for? How did you come to write on that one specifically? This one I was tasked with. I didn't fight for it. It was really great. Anything with humor is always wonderful.

[00:02:58] I was very excited to jump in. All right. Okay. I think Season 2, I didn't actually have an episode that I was just like, I want to write that one. Season 3 is a little different. Oh, okay.

[00:03:11] But the one thing I did fight for for Season 2 was like, can we see Hammer again? Well, thank you. Yeah. Even if he was terrifying, we are glad to see Hammer again.

[00:03:25] Yeah, I was going to bring my, I forgot when we were watching it. I texted the guys like right when we saw Zombie Hammer during the intro credits. I forget what I think it was. It was just a bunch

[00:03:35] of exploding head emojis I texted you guys. Oh yeah. We were very excited for Cameron to see that episode because he is a big horror movie fan and we're like, man, this is about as close as

[00:03:47] you're going to get with Star Trek. Oh yeah. I don't know if I said this during the last time we all met, but I am such a scaredy cat. But I think that maybe what helped me right.

[00:03:59] Maybe you gave us some pretty, uh, sprightly scenes in that episode. Yeah. They do say to write what you know. So if you know how to be scared, I mean, I feel like that really fits. Very true. Awesome.

[00:04:16] All right. Well, let's go ahead and jump into TOS is the devil in the dark. Shall we give them a countdown for those listening along? Yes. So if you're listening

[00:04:26] along at home to the audio version of this, we are going to say three, two, one play. And that will be right on the first frame of this episode because as you may have noticed,

[00:04:37] this episode does not start with credits or a shot of the enterprise. It's just a cold open on a planet somewhere. I love it. Let's take it away. Three, two, one play. Yeah. Jump right in with this one. Wow. And we were kind of wondering.

[00:04:59] Oh, there he is. I didn't even see him the first time. Yeah. Is the cold open something that is mandated for strange new worlds? Like is it part of the structure or does the writer get to pick whether or not the episode has a cold open?

[00:05:13] It's part of the structure actually. And I, it's funny. I never really thought about it. I love a good cold open. But we, we designed it that way so that the audience knows whose

[00:05:23] episode it is, which is why we also open with the captain's log. And so it just kind of becomes part of the formula for the show, especially because we have such a big cast. Right. Yeah.

[00:05:38] Yeah. This is so, I mean, I don't know if it's an older TV thing, but like to start a scene that doesn't feature any of the main characters, like I was really impressed with

[00:05:52] this. It really puts you in the world of Star Trek rather than, you know, on the bridge where you're familiar with. And I think it helps with that sense of unease, right? Everyone in this episode at this mining facility is just terrified from the beginning.

[00:06:08] And it's also, oh, I'm sorry. No, no, go ahead. No, I was going to say it also really reminds you that they are in space and there are other people in space. There's other colonies. It's not just we're on the enterprise, but

[00:06:21] everyone is affected by what's going on. Everyone can meet an alien that's killing them while they're trying to work. And that's what I really enjoy about this episode. I also got to say Schmitter is such an unfortunate name. Seriously. Portschmitter. Why, Mom? Why?

[00:06:42] I really love that it's just like, you know, use whatever accent you have. It's okay to sound like you're from Boston here. Oh no. And a little bit of subversion here. He's not in

[00:06:55] a red shirt. He's in an orange jumpsuit. My favorite in a horror is always when they're you're going to be five. Oh, yeah. I know they're like four hours you'll be fine. They weren't away

[00:07:08] like four seconds and the alien showed up. Yeah. Somebody can be here in three minutes. Now granted, it's going to take you four seconds to die, but you know. We're not even going to make it out of the cave. The alien's not playing.

[00:07:27] So you said this episode inspired loss in translation. Was it like you were assigned the episode and then you're like, I should go check out that TOS episode or did it actually inspire the genesis of loss in translation during the pitches?

[00:07:40] Well, during the pitches we definitely did because David Reed who I wrote the episode with is a huge Trekkie. And I watched all these episodes before I became the writer assistant. Like, you know, I should probably watch every TOS episode. And this one was

[00:07:55] one of the ones that really stuck out to me. One of my favorites. I think in the opening it's just the music. Oh, so good. I love it. And then the close-ups. Oh, just like the other one. So it was in the back of my mind when we

[00:08:10] were writing loss in translation. We just more lost translation stays on the enterprise, but it's still figuring out what the core that someone can die is more with you or if that makes sense. Yeah. But I know that this episode was on the back of

[00:08:32] every writer's mind as we're pitching the story and building the pieces. I really just the pacing of this is for the 60s, this has got to be considered breakneck pacing. Right? Like the story starts right away and then we get a beam down. And I gotta ask Cameron,

[00:08:55] do you remember where we recently heard about Pergeum? Pergeum. I don't. I can. It was in the Lower Decks Caves episode. Oh, I mean, I was definitely thinking of that episode while watching this for sure.

[00:09:09] Yeah. Funny because we just had a TNG and a DS9 Caves episode over on my podcast. Caves is the theme for the podcast this week. Caves are good ones. Yeah. The caves in this are really good. The set design in this is amazing. The models too.

[00:09:27] Yeah. I love these. The map. To the map that scrolls out of the wall. It's just blue mask and tape on it. Yeah. But that's how you could tell it was the future, right? Yes. They store their things in the

[00:09:44] wall. I always think about how our show currently will look 10 years from now. And then, you know, if folks will be laughing about our graphics. I was just rewatching The Matrix and when he took out the phone from the envelope,

[00:10:04] it's the same thing when watching this. You're just kind of looking at the background and like the map in the back behind Spock and it's not a lot of blinking lights. Pretty minimalist here on the moon. He's got a nice pink outfit.

[00:10:23] I was just going to say that I'm loving the color here, which, you know, I believe was because it was an RCA, was instrumental in the creation of the show and they were making color TVs for the first time. That makes sense.

[00:10:39] I also love the sassiness of Spock. You mean you shot at it? I love sassy Spock. Yeah, I mean we'll get to the button on this episode but that's classic TOS. So obviously we've got the is it alive? Is it not? Oh, we're accidentally harming it

[00:11:04] and everything. Did you manage to weave in any deliberate references to this or was it just kind of thematic inspiration? It was more thematic because I know as I was writing, I was more focused on Eora's emotional journey because within loss and translation,

[00:11:23] she's really coming to terms with what it means to be a Starfleet officer and the loss that she had. I thought it was a really good idea and everyone agreed to wrap up.

[00:11:34] It's not just him or died and then everyone moves on. You see that so often. She also, we mentioned in season one, like her parents passed and her brother, like she's dealing with all these things and having it being dealt with while figuring out what this alien

[00:11:51] species is, is really beautiful. Yeah, they're just kind of sending an SOS to our brain but it's bringing up all this trauma that she hasn't really dealt with and it's a really good weaving of those two stories. Yeah, and I really love that Kirk

[00:12:08] is the one that helps her get through it. One thing that was brought up in the room a lot is that he kept, Kirk does not believe in dying. Like he doesn't believe in death. Like he went

[00:12:21] through, right? Yeah. And so he was like the perfect, yeah. Doesn't believe in the no one situation or scenario. Yeah, exactly. And so he's the perfect person to go through this journey

[00:12:34] with Uhura. I think this episode in particular is a great example of how empathetic Kirk really is as a character because a lot of people, they think back on Kirk, he's a ladies man. He's shoot first, ask questions later but he really actually isn't that way. He's incredibly

[00:12:55] intelligent and he's, I mean this entire episode, his whole thing is I am trying to save the lives of people. You know? I'm not here to kill a monster. I'm here to save this facility because it will

[00:13:09] affect so many people. Yeah. Yeah, there's a he both he and Spock have a turn halfway through that I'm interested in the hero Nitro's take on as a writer. I think it's one of like the most

[00:13:20] interesting parts of the episode. Jen in the chat. Uh oh, somebody's about to die. Oh no. I mean these effects like yes, the actual monster is a little lumpy. Oh, you mean pizza the hut? But I love it though. But the steaming, like the trails of steam

[00:13:46] and the recently cut shapes. I mean it's good effects and this, I can't tell is that a matte painting behind them in the window? It's good whatever it is. Yeah. They're fine because

[00:14:01] they pay and buy it at one point I think so I think it's a model. Yeah and that was the that's like one of the opening shots as well. But yeah, Lost in Translation is kind of like

[00:14:13] what Strange New Worlds does best is like take a classic TOS episode premise and then be like, but you know, what if we actually examine the characters like with this one would be this

[00:14:24] episode if we had if it's spurned McCoy dealing with his dad's death which we don't learn about till right Star Trek five. But yeah just kind of adding that that that juice to it. Yeah.

[00:14:36] I think what's really great about our show right now too is that we have quite a few writers that are huge Trekkies. So a lot of this is done without it even being said said

[00:14:49] which is great because those of us who aren't like encyclopedia Trekkies we can still follow and go okay cool how does this fit into where the characters are in there who fits who's better

[00:15:03] in this story you know and so I think all of us pulling our brain powers together just makes it work really well. Because the hope is oh sorry no please go oh no I was gonna say the

[00:15:16] hope is to get people who know Trekkies and those who don't know Trekkies to be able to come in and enjoy the show. I think yeah Strange New Worlds does that exceptionally yeah how much fun was

[00:15:29] it to write for Pellia? Oh what fun I love Pellia she's such a great character. The uh the yeah her saying like she just said that about him or because he was dead is just one of the best lines

[00:15:41] of season two. I love the the we call it the B story with her with Pellia and Una it's just like my favorite favorite there are so many funny scenes that didn't make it to the actual episode

[00:15:53] because of course we always have more and oh my gosh Rebecca so funny. I just watched the delete scenes on the the Blu-ray last night and yeah the scene with them in the hallway

[00:16:02] where they're just like staring at each other is so good. That was one of the scenes where I was like I know pacing and everything but this would have been nice to leave it. Yes I'm I know it's hard

[00:16:12] when you're editing you're just like oh this is so good we gotta cut we gotta cut this we just had such great actors. Gotta kill those babies. Gotta kill those babies yeah. And they have

[00:16:23] kind of a similar dynamic between them, Pellia and Una as Spock and McCoy where you know Spock is like well maybe this and McCoy's like that's not possible flat out like that's

[00:16:35] not something that we can do and it's not that they're fighting each other it's just that they disagree right. It's it's like a low-level disagreement in basic philosophy that drives some of that character drama and yeah Strangely Worlds really thrives on that. Yeah it doesn't

[00:16:56] Pellia's just I mean she's someone who's lived so long and has been all their instructors it's just really great it was a great dynamic. She's always exasperated. Now Jesse what's the

[00:17:12] TNG episode with the Silicon Base Life? Home soil is that it? That might be it. The ugly bags are mostly water. Oh man. Was that one brought up much, or was it primarily Devil in the Dark?

[00:17:28] Honestly neither were brought it's funny because I don't believe Devil in the Dark was actually stated in the room. I just remember watching it and that was when they asked they were

[00:17:38] pitching I was like oh okay it's like this episode um so I don't believe but then again it could have been and it's been a long time since we constructed this episode and I have

[00:17:55] terrible memories. Oh sorry. Now yeah it was what two years ago at this point? Yeah yeah we have a bit of a running joke here um we call it the Strangely Worlds promote your season in the same

[00:18:08] year that you shot it challenge level impossible. Um I wish. But we're very grateful that now we have something to throw in the face of all those Trekkies that are like you don't know what it was like to

[00:18:28] wait three whole months to find out what happened in best of both worlds it's like yeah we're gonna be waiting like a year and a half to get the resolution to hegemony. Yeah we'll take that.

[00:18:40] First appearance of the creature do they tie in? Spock's hold an egg. Yes he is. I don't know. Jen had mentioned that she would really like to own one of the matte paintings from this series I would

[00:18:51] love to have one of these silicon nodules like yeah super basic prop right but I mean it fits well because it kind of looks like an egg and you don't really pick up on that until they start

[00:19:05] talking about it later and you go how did I miss this? I wasn't sure why Pizza the Hut stole the device and didn't just eat it like it does everything else but. Well I think it's actually

[00:19:19] a really cool parallel to Lost in Translation because it shows intelligence on the part of this thing that they assume is a mindless monster right? Yeah. True now here's the crew that's gonna

[00:19:34] get killed. They're all wearing red shirts. You got like five of them in one spot Mark I see dead people. Now start taking bets on how many die he says at one point like they have 100 men down there

[00:19:53] isn't like the crew of the Enterprise only like two something 200 something? I think two or three at this point. It's definitely not the thousand years of TNG. The number of the crew on the Enterprise. You know what I don't know but yes it's a really big shoot.

[00:20:10] I really enjoy the red shirts. Oh yeah. I like even you know Star Trek is a lot of people are like it's such a cheap show and I'm like it really is not that cheap looking like these

[00:20:31] are great costumes even now I mean this and this transfer I think this is an HD upscale but it's gorgeous. Yeah. Well again the set yeah yeah I mean I know caves are cheap to make but still they

[00:20:45] put some time into this one. Everybody have their phasers ready just in case? I don't have a phaser I need to get one. I've got a Beverly Crusher that's what I have. Hey there you go.

[00:20:58] When I saw these phasers on the shelf at Target I walked up to my wife like a little kid like I have to ask now and she just she bowed her head and went just buy it.

[00:21:18] Puka in the chat says 435 under Kirk so yeah maybe 100 red shirts that they could bring down sounds about right and then 250 under Pike. And this monster has killed 50 people when this episode starts like apparently it seems like you would call for help way before you get to 50 deaths

[00:21:37] at your facility I think. Maybe they're just far away I don't know. That's true this is definitely the era of well this is the only ship in the entire sector despite us having a fleet. So this episode has some amazing Kirk and Spock scenes sadly no horror but

[00:21:58] Anitra Lost in Translation is the iconic meeting of some of these characters. Like what was the responsibility there? All fun. It was great to really bring together all these characters in the I actually just remember

[00:22:24] the shooting that scene more so than writing it writing it was a lot of fun because we had that running joke with with Spock not liking Sam Kirk's messiness. It was like the perfect

[00:22:36] opportunity and then the running joke of the cookie but it was just such an iconic special moment especially considering like everything that just happened like they're relaxing they're becoming friends and they're meeting each other for the first time and it's

[00:22:57] it's not a big moment but for those of us who know Trek it's a big moment you know in the episode it's not like we're bells and whistles they're just meeting at the bar and come join us and

[00:23:08] this is so fun to write and great to film and I loved it and I'm really glad I got I was the one who got the one of the ones who got to write that one so yeah was there a lot of discussion

[00:23:21] about it in the room? Was there a lot of debate about getting that scene just right or no I kind of just leave it up to you they who if I could remember correctly there was a lot of excitement

[00:23:31] so there wasn't much pushback and then everyone's just like yes this has to happen and then we just kind of ran with it um yeah we just ran I just we just ran with it it wasn't much pushback it just

[00:23:46] kind of flows yeah if that makes sense yeah I mean you don't want to overthink it too much because then you're going to like overproduce it and it's going to be this whole thing and it is

[00:23:56] nice that it's just like I'm eating at a bar like you said yeah it's meant to be a light moment with war being that glue because she introduces them and um yeah so it was just really

[00:24:11] a really good moment. Facilitates the communication. Yeah and a great thematic connection to Hurrah's moments in 209 that's what she does she keeps people connected and for her to get that moment of introducing those two is huge. Ethan Peck mentions in the season two blu-ray special

[00:24:32] features that everyone on set for that scene was aware of the gravity of it but tried not to play it heavy they you know because moments in life that end up being momentous later don't always feel

[00:24:44] that way when they happen you just you never know what the repercussions will be. Yeah and that's exactly what happened on set everyone was you know this all together all the all our actors

[00:24:57] really understanding how important the scene was but exactly what what Ethan said on the blu-ray they played it and it was the same thing in the writing as well as it's an important moment but

[00:25:09] a light moment. There's a community of Trekkies on I'm just going to call it Twitter because that's what it is who watch TOS together on Saturday nights and they all tweet along and I was reading

[00:25:24] apparently William Shatner finds out during the filming of this episode that his father has died and you will see some shots where it's very clearly William Shatner's stunt double only shot

[00:25:38] from behind while while Shatner wasn't available for set. I was gonna say you know I don't know when the shots were but he has a lot of just close-up reactions with no lines that are really great in

[00:25:53] this episode like Shatner can deliver a facial reaction. Yeah like you know he's his acting is a joke in some parts of the world but like he delivers and he is very talented and this

[00:26:07] show I mean you can really see how his career grew out of this because the man can command a camera. So here's the the ethical debate beginning of course one of my favorite parts of Lost in

[00:26:28] Translation is just you know how quickly Pike is like all right we're doing this like we trust each other so much. Yeah yeah that's his style of captaining and I think that's really important with Trek across the board is establishing

[00:26:50] how each captain commands differently. Kirk receives his meals, Pike cooks the meals and hands them out. Let's see does Pike eat anything in Lost in Translation? I don't think so. No he missed out on the cookies. Yeah there is another running joke we have that no matter

[00:27:18] what Pike cooks we never get to see him eat it like he makes a lot of really great meals but as soon as he lifts the fork something happens. Classic parent. Classic parent. Oh that's great. Love how Spock just slips in the uh playing all the time. Yeah.

[00:27:48] I merely thought that if the opportunity arose. I will lose no more men. This this conflict between Kirk and Spock it works so well because Spock isn't you know fighting with him like I was saying earlier it's just that they have this

[00:28:03] disagreement about how to proceed and you know what is what is the right thing to do here because all life is sacred especially to Vulcans and it's not that Kirk doesn't agree with that

[00:28:18] it's that he throws back at him yeah this is a needs of the many thing man like we got a lot of people that rely on this pergeum and if there's one thing that we can kill

[00:28:30] to make sure that those things those those people still get this then that's what we have to do. Mm-hmm. I love how they turn the scene comedic at the end too. 2,228.7 computer Spock will always be something I love when he gives precise odds. Pretty good odds.

[00:28:51] Although like Spock if you and him are together those odds aren't the same like you're calculating odds if you're split up but then you two just stick together the entire time. Mm-hmm.

[00:29:03] It is cool to see Kirk use Spock's own logic sort of against him to keep him here and you get this moment of friendship right like hey I think I think you should stay here and he's like don't worry babe I'm not going anywhere.

[00:29:21] But yeah it's interesting that he won't order him to stay he won't say he won't tell him like I think you might not kill the creature if we see it which is ironic because in three scenes Spock's gonna want to kill the creature and Kirk's not.

[00:29:40] This facility operator going we're gonna use clubs to attack this creature is like the energy weapons don't work but let's get sticks come on man. Hey it's a foreman who is like committed to the safety of the men under him gotta respect that.

[00:29:59] Yeah and checkpoint tiger is a great name for a checkpoint. The guy in the pink that actually that we know that he can hit this thing because he shot it once they actually give him a club. Well he tried he had his chance with the phaser didn't work.

[00:30:26] We're gonna give somebody else a chance. Captain we are being watched. Intuition. Intuition. I have to ask Onitra is there a conscious effort to not overuse the Vulcan mind meld in strange new worlds because I mean TOS has a lot of mind melds in it. Yes there is.

[00:30:51] Yes we keep track of how many mind melds. Try not to overdo it. Is there a limit per season or is it just like hey if you can find something else use something else. Yeah there's not a limit per season I think just

[00:31:05] we want to stretch ourselves as storytellers not always just go to mind melds. There should be other ways to solve problems so that's what we try to do as much as possible. Listeners any time you hear us get quiet we're just enraptured by what's on the screen.

[00:31:28] Looking at the pavement floor of this cave. Concrete floor. Yeah they dig down they lay down a floor and then they dig down another level. That makes sense. My back hurts just watching them. Seriously walking in a constant crouch everywhere.

[00:31:54] So when you write you know Crumman I forget who he is is blasted through the nacelle and freezes outside the enterprise and the void of space like do you write all of that like how detailed do you get into those types of sequences.

[00:32:11] Not too detailed because you want to save space on the page. Gotta keep that word count page count down. Yes and then it gets in the hand of the director and then they everyone plans about the DP. So just the basic movements.

[00:32:30] Depending on like I'm someone who will overwrite if I'm left to my own devices. But yeah the scene was maybe two free sentences. So you didn't have to research exactly how one would freeze to death in space to write it. Oh no they actually yeah no we did.

[00:32:57] There was a lot of discussion about how one would I think even Dr. Aaron gave us some notes. So yeah it was really good. Yeah there was a lot of talk it just didn't go into the script like all the

[00:33:15] Did you guys notice in the last scene as soon as Kirk is in danger Spock does not say Captain Kirk he says Jim. That's not quite as easily as you and I walked through air Spock but I see your point. Gotta love a dramatic dolly.

[00:33:40] Also notice Mama a piece of the hut just knocked some of her eggs aside as she came through. Yes Mark it is the prototype prototype for Jim Henson Workshop Mark says yeah. And I wonder clearly there's an actor in this monster.

[00:34:09] I I wonder how direction works for that like are they telling him okay back up okay move forward okay back up or did they just rehearse or is you know there's probably marks on the floor but

[00:34:20] we see a lot of the floor here so I wonder if it's purely rehearsed or if it's just direction that they cut from the audio. I hear the actor actually went and lived for two weeks with some rocks and boulders to really get into the mind is method.

[00:34:37] Method rock creature. I'm gonna eat all this pizza like this rock so this is my favorite turn. The second Kirk is in danger is when Spock is like oh you gotta kill it yeah kill that thing.

[00:34:49] All the red shirts can die trying to preserve it sure but Jim not you. You didn't get away from me. Kill it captain quickly. It's not making any threatening moves Mark. You don't dare take the chance captain kill it.

[00:35:04] I thought you were the one that kept alive captured if possible. Jim your life is in danger. So yeah um her is different visions throughout loss and translation like how did you come up

[00:35:17] with those were there any other kind of horror sequences that were left on the cutting room floor the writers room floor. Say that one more time because I was really into that. Yeah all of her is horror visions and visions throughout loss and translation they start with

[00:35:35] like kind of more horror than lead into her flashbacks to her family but you know we've got zombie hammer we've got a very us seen with her fighting herself uh yeah were there any other ones that didn't make it onto the page or the final the final draft?

[00:35:50] Not that I can remember um because each scene was crafted so that it could tell a story of what the aliens are trying to say to her which we see when she's talking to Sam Kirk um so I can't

[00:36:07] think of any that were left on the cutting room floor. No I don't I can't think of any okay again I say my memory is terrible so I'm sorry everybody. No I think my favorite is the one where she is duplicated and there's herself behind herself

[00:36:29] with that Kubrick stare and that knife I was just oh my gosh that was intense. Yeah and the cut to her punching it's all that's that's a really good scene. I love a him or a zombie hammer but yeah that was a really effective scene.

[00:36:44] That was really great it's like I'm wasn't hitting on you. Chicken scene. Is this monster make anybody else want nachos? Is that is that just me? Like this monster looks kind of delicious. Like food yes. It's made no moves against you.

[00:37:05] Seems to be waiting I tried talking good but didn't do anything. Now we get the reveal of the silicon nodules or maybe they're noticing that these are probably connected to the creature. You know that was my pet name for my kids when they were babies too.

[00:37:23] Oh my little silicon nodule little nodule. He's so round. Actually okay so yeah cute cute weird random cute names we call our kids. My kids pineapple and coconut for some reason that's what we we called them. I have so many names for my daughter.

[00:37:47] I know how it is that's nice not just coconut and pineapple but those are the ones I'm remembering right now. My my big things always come up depending on what mood I'm in and what's happening.

[00:38:04] The ones that my wife and I tend to stick to is the chunk because when she was born you know she had all those extra baby rolls and it was like you just this little chunk of mommy and chunk just stuck.

[00:38:22] But have you ever dressed her up like chunk from the goonies yet? That's a good question. Not to disappoint you Cameron I don't know that I've actually seen the goonies. Well now we've got another live stream opportunity.

[00:38:36] I was very young when that came out if I was born yet. And it says still you're not you're not that far off. I'll put it on the list. Throw gremlins on there while you're at it. If you have a thing gremlins.

[00:38:55] Gremlins I'm nearly certain I've seen it has just been probably 20 plus years but yeah. Okay. Yeah goonies is great. I really like that Spock kind of explains the mind meld like you know having TOSB such an episodic

[00:39:12] show like we've seen 50 mind melds up to this point but a new viewer may not have seen a mind meld so he explains it to Kirk you know remember how we can join two minds? Yeah. No kill it writes was that an exclamation point at the bottom?

[00:39:30] No kill I oh I that's right yeah yeah uh yeah Neemoi puts on some fine performance here when he's doing the mind meld and again a great effect like they got only the letters to smoke like I'm just I'm continuously impressed by that.

[00:39:48] Jen asked how did it learn English? It's a good question. From Spock I suppose but you think it would be Vulcan it would sprite in Vulcan. It's a much more complicated script. It just went with it easy English.

[00:40:06] But yeah that's what it was doing when they thought it was just sitting there waiting it was actually listening and learning and it may have learned from Spock's mind yeah. That's a good question though Jen is Spock actually speaking Vulcan and the universal translator

[00:40:23] is always making it English? He does seem like the kind of guy that would speak English for the benefit of the lesser life forms around him though. It's more logical to do it that way just in case the universal translator breaks down.

[00:40:36] Yeah I like that the administrator is like what happened and he's like don't ask just come down here. So I have to ask do you have the whole backstory written down somewhere of what

[00:40:53] happened to her as parents with the shuttle like why is it Sydney that it crashed in? No just like the background? Yeah it's just in all of our though that's the one thing I do have

[00:41:05] a good memory for characters and where you know like I remember I think it has a wife and Pike's father was religious and those little details I believe all the writers keep in their

[00:41:21] head but it's not something we have written anywhere and someone will bring it up you know it's like where where's this character at and so yeah. Okay I know on some of the older Star Trek shows I don't know about TOS but I know

[00:41:37] TNG and Voyager for example had what's called the show Bible where it's you know all of just the super basic details on characters. Does Strange New Worlds have one of those?

[00:41:49] No not that I'm aware of. That's a good question. We do one pagers at the top of each season just kind of explaining where everyone's at and what we're going to do differently this season but we don't necessarily have a Bible. Gotcha just to keep us head.

[00:42:13] And Henry's. Yeah pretty rude of that security officer to just say these guys are all ugly. Right titular devils it is incredible that the Vulcan mind mailed will work with a silicone-based

[00:42:37] life form. That and I wonder if that's part of the resistance to overusing it in Strange New Worlds is it's arguably a little bit magic or it feels like magic right to the viewer. Vulcan mysticism. Yeah we all love space magic but yeah I like that Spock really

[00:43:02] established early on that it's not just knowledge transference it's an emotional transference and that really plays into the Saric episode in TNG when Picard is so emotionally affected by Saric. I don't know when I was watching this the other day I was like this is pretty good but

[00:43:21] needs more McCoy and he did not disappoint when he showed up McCoy is fantastic in this episode. Yeah I don't see any paint peeling off of that thing. McCoy is like skeptical of things he can

[00:43:44] actually see like he's a true skeptic like yeah it's happening in front of me but I still don't know if I believe it virtually. Hey Mark got there first good job Mark. McCoy just gave us classic I'm a Dr. Nade in this case Bricklayer.

[00:44:25] Now when you're writing with someone else I think you kind of explained it last time but you kind of break apart the scenes you hand out the different scenes so you would do some and

[00:44:32] was it read on this episode you said? Yeah yeah we depending on who you're writing with you discuss between the two of you who wants to take which act and then go from there.

[00:44:50] Okay so it's by act kind of. And you can break it up anyway you could do teaser act one and two you can do teaser act two and four like you can it just all depends. Chamber of the Ages sounds like a Legend of Zelda game.

[00:45:10] It does. They're like in 80s hair band album. Oh man now I want that. Yeah he like I just think like yeah 80s album like yeah heavy metal album cover artwork as a genre for Strangereal World Season 3 and that's gonna be one of my guesses.

[00:45:35] Producer John sent us a note from the North Pole apparently this is the first ever McCoyism. Oh wow that's exciting. The thing you search for is there. Go. Go. Really glad we finally got to see some emotional Spock in season 2 of Strangereal Worlds because

[00:46:13] yes obviously he's known for the stoicism and the logic but TOS Spock has a lot of emotions and yeah some of it is because of mind melds but I mean like even in the cage he's smiling ear to ear when they've passed the ringing flowers and

[00:46:29] it really adds some great depth to his character. Yeah I agree and it's great because we're dealing with a Spock before he was the Spock that was well known and you know this is his

[00:46:46] first time on the Enterprise and it gives you a lot of storytelling room which is nice. It makes him really easy to relate to too despite being you know an alien character ostensibly.

[00:47:01] Oh yeah and a lot of his story is relatable I mean a dad who he disappoints a mom who he doesn't quite understand until he does so it's relatable. That scene in charades where he

[00:47:16] apologizes to her like I teared up big time I was like I should probably call my mom too. Yeah hug your mom. Yeah Amanda's a great surrogate mother for us all. So when you're writing James T. Kirk

[00:47:36] do you go back and watch any of the T.O.S. or the movies to kind of get into his mannerisms or dialogue? I personally don't because we're also dealing with James before he was captain of Enterprise

[00:47:51] and so it's a good for me I feel like it's good to start fresh where he's younger he's new he's also kind of finding his place and he's got this rivalry with his brother that's also relatable and fun so I don't. But other writers might.

[00:48:14] But that confidence that he is known for is definitely still there as his strength that I think it serves really well in strange new worlds. Yeah yeah there's a core of people

[00:48:27] that are just you know it's gonna be there and I think I mean even when you've watched the movies it's that same like fun but he's still super confident. Yeah Mark said to look out for face

[00:48:56] huggers in the previous egg room and that's a good note. Pink suit turning on his own team come on man this is for Schmitter. That's right. Oh shoot Kirk serious that thing killed 50 men. You've killed

[00:49:27] thousands of her children. I was around Silicon Nodules that you've been collecting and destroying they're her eggs. But much like Mike like these guys do uh they do do a 180 pretty quick and you

[00:49:40] know that's what's always appreciated about Star Trek is. Yeah we'd all like to think this is how we would react. Yeah it always points to the better nature that we are capable of

[00:49:54] you know and it gives you and specifically like in Lost in Translation like we'll do whatever we have to to strengthen the Federation unless we find out that we're hurting somebody because that's

[00:50:06] that's not what we're about and it's so cool to see that just work on such an intuitive level for these characters and in strange new worlds. Yeah it's um it's a show for to be

[00:50:21] hopeful you know it's not all dark. The world is dark and there's things even in our show that happens but there's always our crew that pulls through and remembers their humanity or their

[00:50:34] bulk and me bulk and this. Yeah Kiva and Henry both used I think the term empathy generators and and radical empathy as a philosophy and that I mean I think that that's both present in TOS and Strange New Worlds but I think it's also

[00:50:57] something that you guys have managed to weave into the story without kind of beating people over the head with it like some kind of pink jumpsuit guy. We need a club. I was saying that next time Kiva we need a club. These were club moments.

[00:51:14] Name it empathy. Can you imagine Bernadette Croft's take on this pink jumpsuit you guys? It would be so fabulous. It would be. Oh great. All right speaking of when Bernadette was here one

[00:51:30] of my favorite notes she had was they had added in little space worms space maggots to the himmer outfit did you did they point those out to you did you get to see them? No. How excited were you to see Zombie Hammer when they made them up?

[00:51:45] I was very excited and I was really into the makeup should have paid more attention. Apparently there's tiny space maggots in the clothes he was wearing. Yeah the whole entire outfit was just so I mean everything was just so amazing our team

[00:52:05] so great the crew so good yeah so good I love the the joy on McCoy's face even though he's like wrist deep in uh silicon goo he is so pleased with himself.

[00:52:25] Cycle. Adventure. He's like I did it. Did it. Ship ready to leave orbit captain course laid it and then yes the classic TOS button which is it's just always like maybe not always the ones I

[00:52:45] remember are always these three just having a little little chuckle moment amongst themselves. Yeah and I always wonder like okay so there's almost always a yeoman with like a clipboard is that supposed to represent like okay we've made the report on this because

[00:53:02] we never see them make the report they just go all right what's next and it works because it's episodic right but I mean there would be so much paperwork after this. Yeah. She found humanoid appearance revolting but she thought she could get used to it.

[00:53:23] Oh she did did she? Tell me did you happen to make any comment about those ears? Not specifically. He's so sassy he's like the horta thinks humans are disgusting but she thinks the ears are the best part.

[00:53:45] She's highly intelligent with impeccable taste. Yes because she approved of you. Does not bear close examination Mr. Spark I suspect you're becoming more and more human all the time. Oh so good. The humor in TOS is underrated it honestly is. It's so clever it's very subtle

[00:54:10] and it's true to life like this is how you give your friends the business right like you're not swearing at them you're not insulting them you're just you know kind of poking at them

[00:54:21] it just works so well. Yeah well that was devil in the dark thank you so much for watching with us Anitra. Yes of course thank you for having me. Absolutely well very excited to see what's coming up

[00:54:34] in season three um yeah I mean apparently there's some episodes you're really excited for that you fought for but is there a single one word tease you can give us for what we might expect in season

[00:54:47] three. Oh man no I kept trying to think of one just oh my goodness what was your word what was your season two word do we remember? It was charades. Oh charades that's right which I gotta say thank you

[00:55:06] because as a show we were like holy crap we just we got a scoop and we didn't even know it they didn't name the freaking episode charades and we've known that for a year.

[00:55:18] But we didn't know it but we knew it. That's the best kind. Season three is so big I'm trying my best to think of one word and the only one I could think of is love love yeah love love I'm gonna

[00:55:34] I'm gonna go ahead and steal big also. Yes big love. Big and love. Maybe big love I don't know. I love it all right folks well I think we're coming up on the end of this second stream of

[00:55:52] thought I want to thank all of the patrons who joined us in the chat Puka, Jen, Mark, Steve I think you might be in there or you'll be in there in spirit. Thank you again to producer John

[00:56:05] for putting in the work even though you're all the way up at the North Pole I can't believe how much effort that you continue to put into this show you really are the piece that holds it

[00:56:15] all together so thank you for working your magic and those of you who are here live make sure you pay attention in a couple of days when our Christmas special drops because there is going to

[00:56:28] be so much Christmas fun in there and maybe even a little bit of a reading of this Star Trek Christmas book Trek the Hose. That's news to me even. Yeah just keep your eyes open. There will also be

[00:56:42] news of another another Christmas stream coming up so yes pay attention. Yes we are very excited to share the holidays with you all. Onitra thank you again so much for being here. Yeah always

[00:56:53] anytime. Thank you both. So much fun with season three and yeah for sure you'll I'm sure you'll hear from us again so I'm pointing out that comes out. No problem. Always a pleasure and I'll let

[00:57:07] you know I'll let you know how I feel about the fifth season. Yes please do I'm excited but like I said definitely one of the best prologues I ever read and there's a map

[00:57:16] just you can attest if there's a map in a book. You're in awesome well it's great seeing you both John I hope you are having fun in the North Pole and I will see you guys next time. All right bye

[00:57:29] Onitra have a good one folks. Once again thank you so much to Onitra Johnson an absolute delight every time she stops by the open pike night stage and we cannot wait to get her back

[00:57:43] after season three it sounds like she's very excited. I wonder we didn't ask her if she got the episode she fought for in season three. Oh man that would have been the obvious follow up.

[00:57:54] So I wonder if she got it. It'll be fun to try to figure out which one that was. Yeah especially I mean I'm hoping we still get screeners for season three but that'll be like two years since

[00:58:05] our last screener so yeah hopefully the season five discovery screeners will give us a clue as to whether or not we are still on that list but it has been a long night and we should probably

[00:58:19] start wrapping this thing up so Cameron if folks want to hear more from you where can they do that. Yeah they can mosey on over to Greenshirt a newbie's trek through TNG where I'm just started

[00:58:30] season seven of TNG for the very first time I think when this drops it'll be a week before our season six finale with Wendy editor and producer of Greatest Trek and Greatest Generation guesting on

[00:58:43] to talk about that that finale. Very cool I remember being at the Pranaka Cabanica with Wendy and talking all about editing and things like that and man talk about a professional producer we

[00:58:57] can say that because John's not here right now but like wow I am very much looking forward to that and of course if you need to get a hold of OpenPike night on the social media apps

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[00:59:57] you can go anywhere you want but you can't stay here look out for the uh pizza the huts